Detroit Auto Show - New Mustang

[True Blue Aggie]

http://www.mrhowdy.com/stuff/carshow/carshow%20%2838%29.JPG

Now this is something I would stand in line and wait for. This is what the Mustang should look like! This better get built.....FORD, build this car!

http://www.mrhowdy.com/stuff/carshow/carshow%20(39).JPG
http://www.mrhowdy.com/stuff/carshow/carshow%20(41).JPG

[Tex Arcana]

Ah, yes... the Guigaro design study. Very nice indeed, and would make a great next-gen refresh ('cept the taillights, they don't quite work), but for some reason I can't see Ford doing this. :(

edit: dammit, damned slow internet, I didn't se the thrid pic 'til after I posted. :hammer: They tails look better in that shot, than in other shots i've seen.

[dboat]

I was there and stood in line and saw it.. it was pretty nice, but not a show stopper..

Dana

[ChronicReign]

I like everything but the tails and the solid glass roof. Any engine specs yet? I know it is heavily concept, but still.....

[98Cobra]

I like everything but the tails and the solid glass roof. Any engine specs yet? I know it is heavily concept, but still.....

+1. The tails just...miss the point, somehow.

[TXLIGHTNING]

I like it. :tu:

[tiffo60]

id buy it if it was just like that in the 30k range, but that one im sure they will sticker for 50k and more than likely try to get 60 or 70k out of it

[Ohmsby]

When will we see a Mustang that will go Z06 number's the pony crowd would eat it up

[gagspa]

When will we see a Mustang that will go Z06 number's the pony crowd would eat it up
It isn't going to happen without getting near the Z06 pricetag. The Shelby is the closest thing and is $40K plus dealer markups.

[JNYLTN5.4]

http://www.thecarconnection.com/Enthusiasts/Spy_Shots_and_Future_Cars/2009_Ford_Mustang_Spy_Shots.S178.A11761.html

[Mark #2]

http://www.thecarconnection.com/Enthusiasts/Spy_Shots_and_Future_Cars/2009_Ford_Mustang_Spy_Shots.S178.A11761.html

I saw that too, I get the daily updates from thecarconnection, like the site.
Updating the Mustang already, kind of surprising.

[Tex Arcana]

I like everything but the tails and the solid glass roof. Any engine specs yet? I know it is heavily concept, but still.....

The Guigaro concept is built on a GT platform, so it's just a GT.

[LocoLightning02]

That looks nice but Im holding out for 2010. Thats when the L will be paid for:beer: and of course Im going to keep it:)

[Ohmsby]

It isn't going to happen without getting near the Z06 pricetag. The Shelby is the closest thing and is $40K plus dealer markups.
my point being that the Shelby with mark up is nearly at the Z06 cost and won't outrun a stock lightning (we saw one @ ThunderValley ) Pony die hards would pay 60K for a 11 sec stang

[99WhiteBeast]

I can't see them changing the current stang yet. I think its just a ploy to fool the public that Ford is actually doing something.

Ford's pattern has been 5 years or so with a specific look before a design change.
88-93
94-98
99-04
05-??

[LocoLightning02]

read in a magazine that ford will redo the mustang in 2010. The same time that dodge and chevy will put the challenger(which wont have a base model and is expected to run about 40 grand) and the camero(which is the ugliest car I think ive ever seen. That would be the 5th years so I guess we will just have to wait and see.

Got my new issue of mm&ff and they had the first 9 sec shelby

pulley,headers,gears,75 shot,tune,gears and slicks. We all know how much that cost. The shelby ran 9.96@141.5 Next month they are putting the kb on. This is a z06 killer:beer:

[Tex Arcana]

I can't see them changing the current stang yet. I think its just a ploy to fool the public that Ford is actually doing something.

Ford's pattern has been 5 years or so with a specific look before a design change.
88-93
94-98
99-04
05-??

It's not really a "ploy", it's just Guigaro being Guigaro, showcasing their talents and their business.

Remember that Corvette interpretation he did a few years ago, that was absolutely balls-out gorgeous? GM wouldn't let him put the "Corvette" name on it, even tho it would have been positive publicity--heck, they wouldn't even give him a car to make it out of, so he had to use his own C5 as a basis.

IF Ford were smart, they would incorporate elements form this into the next gen, and they would use Guigaro's services to make it happen--fat chance, but hey, we can hope.

[BC Lightning]

read in a magazine that ford will redo the mustang in 2010. The same time that dodge and chevy will put the challenger(which wont have a base model and is expected to run about 40 grand) and the camero(which is the ugliest car I think ive ever seen. That would be the 5th years so I guess we will just have to wait and see.

Got my new issue of mm&ff and they had the first 9 sec shelby

pulley,headers,gears,75 shot,tune,gears and slicks. We all know how much that cost. The shelby ran 9.96@141.5 Next month they are putting the kb on. This is a z06 killer:beer:

gotta have alot of gears I guess

Stock C6 was killing a stock Shelby in car and driver magazine, sad that a car that is marked up to about the same as the new Z06 has to have that many mods to compete with it

put that amount of mods and a KB with 75 shot on the new Z06 and it will be able to compete with Saleen S7's, Lambo Murchalegio's, Bugattis and other $500,000+ cars

Back on topic:

I like the new body style of the stang including the tails

[wesman]

read in a magazine that ford will redo the mustang in 2010. The same time that dodge and chevy will put the challenger(which wont have a base model and is expected to run about 40 grand) and the camero(which is the ugliest car I think ive ever seen. That would be the 5th years so I guess we will just have to wait and see.

Got my new issue of mm&ff and they had the first 9 sec shelby

pulley,headers,gears,75 shot,tune,gears and slicks. We all know how much that cost. The shelby ran 9.96@141.5 Next month they are putting the kb on. This is a z06 killer:beer:

The challenger will be an '08 model and it has base models all the way up to the 6.1 Hemi. I've reserached this car quite a bit, I was thinking of making it the next purchase but the plan has changed.


Challenger Concept (http://www.dodge.com/en/challenger/index.html)

--wes

[TP Derrick D]

Nice looking car!!! color,body& tails!!! I didn't know there was so many Mustang lovers on here. When yall gonna bring them out and lets see them.Steve-O, I know you had a Stang and sold it but the first year in the years you mentioned was '87 but you're right about the 5-6 year body style altho the engine & interior overlaps the years of bodystyles with subtle changes.

[TXLIGHTNING]

My SVT dealer tells me that there will be a new mustang body style in 2008 or 09. There is supposed to be a new line of SVT vehicles around the same time.

[Lyfisin]

The challenger will be an '08 model and it has base models all the way up to the 6.1 Hemi. I've reserached this car quite a bit, I was thinking of making it the next purchase but the plan has changed.

That's what I thought also. Just today I found this link from December, by a supposed "insider" who says it might not be that way though.

http://hemidakota.blogspot.com/2006/12/looking-into-dodge-challenger-crystal.html

Who knows what will happen. I think the car looks sweet also, but I'm not as big on it now as I was when I first saw it.

[BC Lightning]

My SVT dealer tells me that there will be a new mustang body style in 2008 or 09. There is supposed to be a new line of SVT vehicles around the same time.

From what our Ford dealer Ray Trevino at Bill Utter Ford said is the new line is to compete with the new market of AWD and Turbo type cars

[LocoLightning02]

The challenger will be an '08 model and it has base models all the way up to the 6.1 Hemi. I've reserached this car quite a bit, I was thinking of making it the next purchase but the plan has changed.


Challenger Concept (http://www.dodge.com/en/challenger/index.html)

--wes


What I read was a 5.7 to a 6.1 there would be no v6 base model:)
Dont know why anyone would want one, but ford sure sells alot of mustang with a six bang in it.
Please forgive my typing diffculty bc:bows

Off Topic:

im a proud new parent of a 7lb 15ounce baby girl. Born 1-22-07 at 3:15pm

[dboat]

What I read was a 5.7 to a 6.1 there would be no v6 base model:)
Dont know why anyone would want one, but ford sure sells alot of mustang with a six bang in it.
Please forgive my typing diffculty bc:bows

Off Topic:

im a proud new parent of a 7lb 15ounce baby girl. Born 1-22-07 at 3:15pm


Some like the looks and dont care about the performance so much.. hence the sixer

Congrats on the kiddo!!!:tu:

Dana

[BC Lightning]

Off Topic:

im a proud new parent of a 7lb 15ounce baby girl. Born 1-22-07 at 3:15pm

Congrats :beer:

[02BOLT]

gotta have alot of gears I guess

Stock C6 was killing a stock Shelby in car and driver magazine, sad that a car that is marked up to about the same as the new Z06 has to have that many mods to compete with it

put that amount of mods and a KB with 75 shot on the new Z06 and it will be able to compete with Saleen S7's, Lambo Murchalegio's, Bugattis and other $500,000+ cars

Back on topic:

I like the new body style of the stang including the tails

OT...
Easy there bro. I too am a huge fan of the C6 ZO6, but let's not be so harsh on the GT500. The car stickers for around $45K, it's not Ford's fault that the greedy a$$ dealers are raping everyone who wants one. Problem is, people are paying the fricking ADM's, due to all the "Shelby" hype. If the car were simply badged "SVT Cobra", I don't believe the hype would be nearly as ridiculous. By most accounts, Ford is intent on building 8,000-12,000 GT500's a year for the next 2-3 years, so the laws of supply and demand dictate that the prices will have to come back to earth sooner or later.

It's also still pretty hard to get a ZO6 for sticker. They had 5 of them at Vandergriff in Arlington a few weeks ago, and were asking $10K over($86K total) for every one of them.

The GT500 was never meant to compete with the ZO6. It is a vastly inferior car in terms of all around performance, and build materials. It's a 2+2 Muscle Car, whereas the ZO6 is a World Class Sports car. However, you gotta admit that running mid-low 11's(even 10's)and trapping 125mph+ with the simple addition of a pulley, intake, tune, gears, and some sticky tires is pretty cool. IMHO, if you can pick one of these bad boys up at sticker, and slap these bolt-ons on it, it's the deal of the frickin' century in terms of bang for the buck, straight line acceleration.

Once again, the C6 ZO6 is an absolutely INCREDIBLE car. Chevy really did their homework on that sucker, and it is one Bad Muther Scratcher....Period. All I'm saying is to give credit where credit is due, and the GT500, while a C6 Z it is not; is still a pretty kick a$$ car in its own right. Just my .02....:cool:

[L8 APEX]

My beef with the 500 and all Ford cars since 94 is weight, weight, weight. The 500 might as well be a truck! Once you have driven a sub 3200lb fully framed, rigid, balanced beast you will spit at a unibody nose heavy kiddo rocket. Classic Chevy in Grapevine has been selling Z's at sticker when you order them. A customer of mine bought one off the floor for 3K over sticker last year. They are a good dealership;) .

[Silver_2000]

It's also still pretty hard to get a ZO6 for sticker. They had 5 of them at Vandergriff in Arlington a few weeks ago, and were asking $10K over($86K total) for every one of them.
Its only 1300 a month for 60 months .... :evil:evil:evil:evil

[dboat]

Its only 1300 a month for 60 months .... :evil:evil:evil:evil

true, but with a trade in and some other cash, they are still a great deal.. however, I have a personal philosophy that I wont finance a car for more than 36 months, hence, no Z06 in my garage.. :crying:

Dana

[Tex Arcana]

My beef with the 500 and all Ford cars since 94 is weight, weight, weight. The 500 might as well be a truck! Once you have driven a sub 3200lb fully framed, rigid, balanced beast you will spit at a unibody nose heavy kiddo rocket. Classic Chevy in Grapevine has been selling Z's at sticker when you order them. A customer of mine bought one off the floor for 3K over sticker last year. They are a good dealership;) .

Thing is, in order to get rigidity and crash-worthiness, and give people a solid, quiet, smooth ride, you just can't get away from the additional material needed to make it happen. Even going aluminum isn't going to save more than a couple hundred pounds, if only for the extra material needed to reinforce it in key areas for strength and longevity.

[BC Lightning]

Classic Chevy in Grapevine has been selling Z's at sticker when you order them. A customer of mine bought one off the floor for 3K over sticker last year. They are a good dealership;) .

We only buy our Chevy's and bought my first Lightning through Ken Thompson at Classic Chevy (even bought through him when he was at Frank Parra)

[L8 APEX]

Thing is, in order to get rigidity and crash-worthiness, and give people a solid, quiet, smooth ride, you just can't get away from the additional material needed to make it happen. Even going aluminum isn't going to save more than a couple hundred pounds, if only for the extra material needed to reinforce it in key areas for strength and longevity.
You missed the point. The Corvette has a fully boxed frame. In 1998 it was the 5th most rigid car chasis in the world. I could jack up one corner of the car and all three corners would lift up together. That is a 3200lb car with a full steel frame. My partner Ethan got rear ended in his 98 C5 by a half ton pickup truck on I-75. He was stopped and the truck was going 50mph. It totaled the truck and barely smacked the C5 with only 8 grand in mostly cosmetic damage . I have seen a lot of crashed cars and the Corvette chasis does very well, it is rigid, nimble, and a pleasure to drive. When it comes to Mustangs they bow, twist and creak. The first 03 Cobra I built was a convertible. It flexed so much you couldn't see images out of the rear view mirror going over bridge joints and rail road tracks the whole front pillar/windhshield section would shake. When Mustangs wreck they are totaled and split in half easily. Unibody is heavier and weaker.

[my2002lightning]

Congrats LocoLightning02,

These babies are certainly a blessing. Zane is 8 mo. old now and can hold his own formula bottle, can sit up-right unassisted and say "Daddy".:)

I wish the best for you, your family and your new baby-daughter.:tu:

Ronald and Zane






Off Topic:

im a proud new parent of a 7lb 15ounce baby girl. Born 1-22-07 at 3:15pm

[Tex Arcana]

You missed the point. The Corvette has a fully boxed frame. In 1998 it was the 5th most rigid car chasis in the world. I could jack up one corner of the car and all three corners would lift up together. That is a 3200lb car with a full steel frame. My partner Ethan got rear ended in his 98 C5 by a half ton pickup truck on I-75. He was stopped and the truck was going 50mph. It totaled the truck and barely smacked the C5 with only 8 grand in mostly cosmetic damage . I have seen a lot of crashed cars and the Corvette chasis does very well, it is rigid, nimble, and a pleasure to drive. When it comes to Mustangs they bow, twist and creak. The first 03 Cobra I built was a convertible. It flexed so much you couldn't see images out of the rear view mirror going over bridge joints and rail road tracks the whole front pillar/windhshield section would shake. When Mustangs wreck they are totaled and split in half easily. Unibody is heavier and weaker.


Corvette's aren't exactly a good choice for comparison, because they're so small--and even then darned heavy (speaking of, why don't people slam the 'vette for being so darn heavy???).

AS for your accident example: how far did the 'vette slide from the impact point? In other words, how much of the impact energy was turned into motion?

I think we're hitting the point of diminishing returns, honestly. For the rigidity of a decent platform, there has to be weight to make it happen. Dear wifey's SLK320 is a heavy little beast, but it's tight as a chunk of billet steel. There's the tradeoff again: weight vs. rigidity.

[L8 APEX]

You're an idiot Tex and I am wasting my time typing a reply. The vette is one of the lightest sports cars on the road. The Viper is 3450#. It is also one of the widest. It is full size it is not tiny by any measure of exterior demisions.

[Tex Arcana]

You're an idiot Tex and I am wasting my time typing a reply. The vette is one of the lightest sports cars on the road. The Viper is 3450#. It is also one of the widest. It is full size it is not tiny by any measure of exterior demisions.

If I'm an idiot, yet can figure out that weight is inevitable (especially when comparing apples and grapfruits--i.e. Corvettes to trucks), then what the hell kind of retard does that make you?? :hammer:

[L8 APEX]

You said they can't make a car strong without making it heavy unless it uses exotic materials. I said the Corvette has a fully boxed steel frame and is one of the lightest sports cars you can buy at 3200lbs. I was comparing that to the Mustang 500 or any other that weighs 3600-3900lbs and are flimsy as a beer can with crap unibody construction. Where do you come up with the vette being "darned heavy"? Show me a lighter American V8 powered car?

[gbgary]

Classic Chevy in Grapevine has been selling Z's at sticker when you order them. A customer of mine bought one off the floor for 3K over sticker last year. They are a good dealership;) .


i've been lurking on a corvette board lately and there are "supporting dealers" there that are selling them at 1k below sticker. there happens to be a glut of Z06s right now. there's a dealership in our area that's selling base C6s for 39.9k.

[Tex Arcana]

You said they can't make a car strong without making it heavy unless it uses exotic materials. I said the Corvette has a fully boxed steel frame and is one of the lightest sports cars you can buy at 3200lbs. I was comparing that to the Mustang 500 or any other that weighs 3600-3900lbs and are flimsy as a beer can with crap unibody construction. Where do you come up with the vette being "darned heavy"? Show me a lighter American V8 powered car?

At 3200 lbs, the Corvette is heavy for a two-seat sports car. Problem is, nearly ALL modern sports cars (except maybe the Lotus offerings) are over 3000lbs--and if you compare the modern 'vette to older models, you'll see what I mean, the new ones are bloated in comparison to the old ones.

And that supports my point: in order to build a stiff structure, with reasonable crashworthiness, and to give the customer all the creature comforts he or she requires, the smooth ride, the sound and temperature insulation, the vehicle is going to be heavier than a similarly-sized vehicle built 20, 30, or 40 years ago.

And the bottom line is you can't get away from weight, it's always going to be there.