Formula One Countdown 2008

[dboat]

Well, here we are the weekend of the Daytona 500 and just less than 4 weeks away from the first practice session in Australia to start the 2008 Formula One season. What a season 2007 was, with Kimi coming from 3rd place on the last race of the season to win the DC, Ferrari essentially had the Constructors title handed to them with the penalty that was assessed on Mercedes McLaren, and then the entire drama around the theft of information and the feuding amongst the MMcL drivers. Wow, what a season that was.

But here we are about to start another great season of racing and it will be the first one without a driver named Schumacher in an F1 car in quite some time. There is a new team Force India in the mix. Alonso is back with Renault. The hottest drivers are from Finland in Kimi and Kovaleinen (sp). Massa is looking fast, everyone is wondering will MMcL do well and will the talented rookie Lewis Hamilton have a sophomore jinx. Or will there car be as competitive as last year since all their changes have to be run through an F1 review board first. Or now that Honda has gotten their wind tunnel issue fixed, can Rubens B (the real elder statesman in F1 now) or Jenson Button (one of my personal favorite drivers), one of the nicest drivers in F1, make a real run at the title or at least podium on a consistent basis.

It should be a great year of racing with lots competition.

Dana

[dboat]

Post up your early season predictions for this year..

top 5 drivers in points
top 3 teams in points

I will do a search on last year and see what the results were.

Mika, still have that love/hate relationship with Ferrari?

Tex, where have you gone?

Sixpipes, you still watching?

Dana

[Mika]

Drivers:
1. Kimi(I have to)
2. Hamilton(actually, he may be the #1 guy, if the car can stay together)
3. Massa(any of these top 3 can be switched from week to week).
4. Alonso(good drive, reliable but not quick car) *
5. Heikki(love to see 2 Finns in the top 5-go figure)

*this could bite me in the butt later on this season!

Teams
1. Ferrari
2. McLaren
3. Renault

I still have a love/hate with Ferrari. Last season's CC was tainted by McLaren's cheating. I'm also surprised that Lewis lost his cool in the last few races.

One thing is pretty much for sure. With all the equal or near equal talent in F1, it should make for one heck of a season.



Mika

[dboat]

Drivers:
1. Kimi(I have to)
2. Hamilton(actually, he may be the #1 guy, if the car can stay together)
3. Massa(any of these top 3 can be switched from week to week).
4. Alonso(good drive, reliable but not quick car) *
5. Heikki(love to see 2 Finns in the top 5-go figure)

*this could bite me in the butt later on this season!

Teams
1. Ferrari
2. McLaren
3. Renault

I still have a love/hate with Ferrari. Last season's CC was tainted by McLaren's cheating. I'm also surprised that Lewis lost his cool in the last few races.

One thing is pretty much for sure. With all the equal or near equal talent in F1, it should make for one heck of a season.

Mika

my pics wont be much different. I think HK can be in the top 5.. I would like to see Button up there and Alonse way down there..
Dana

[Mika]

It was a toss up between Button and Heikki. I got to go with my blood though. Wouldn't be surprised one bit if Kubica squeezes up there either. This year actually may be the first year in many years where there's more than 2 teams vying for DC(Ferrari, McLaren, possibly BMW, possibly Honda).



Mika

[dboat]

It was a toss up between Button and Heikki. I got to go with my blood though. Wouldn't be surprised one bit if Kubica squeezes up there either. This year actually may be the first year in many years where there's more than 2 teams vying for DC(Ferrari, McLaren, possibly BMW, possibly Honda).

Mika

I got to agree with you. It shouldnt be a runaway by any stretch. I think it will be a really good year to watch.. I dont expect Bourdais to do much even though his team is going to expect him too.
I could see the young Vettel do something, if he was on a better team, but he will dazzle on occasion. IMHO.

Dana

[dboat]

Two weeks and counting.. well at least from midnight tonite EST..

Dana

[dboat]

Oh and dont forget..

This year, no traction control and no antilock braking either..
and the lap times are coming in at 3-4 tenths within lap times of last year.

Dana

[Mika]

I wish back when Hakk was driving they kept the ABS and TC away from F1. That's where Mika really excelled at(the starts). He knew how to control the rear end and almost always found at least a spot or two by the first corner. This season a true driver will show.



Mika

[dboat]

I wish back when Hakk was driving they kept the ABS and TC away from F1. That's where Mika really excelled at(the starts). He knew how to control the rear end and almost always found at least a spot or two by the first corner. This season a true driver will show.
Mika

Agreed and I think it will be interesting needless to say.. cant wait for the racing to begin.. just think, in just over a week, we will see the first practice sessions.. although, Super Friends are really behind the 8 ball since they havent dont track time anywhere..:nono:

Dana

[dboat]

til the first practice session of the new season..

anyone else excited?

Dana

[Mika]

It seems that its just you and I, Dana. Oh well. Picks for Sunday(Saturday for us)'s race?

1. Lewis
2. Massa
3. Kimi
4. Alonso
5. Heikki
6. Kubica



Mika

[dboat]

Mika, I thought that we would at least get Sixer and Mark in here too..

I agree with your top 5, but in a different order..

1. Kimi
2. Hamilton
3. Massa
4. Heikki
5. Kubica

and just how bad will the ex-SuperFriends team be this year without testing? :eek::eek::eek:

Dana

[dboat]

Mika, you staying up tonite to watch the first practice session? or are you going to record it?

Dana

[Mika]

I'll probably be up tonight...work switched over to 4 10 hour days. So now I work Mon-Thurs:).



Mika

[dboat]

I'll probably be up tonight...work switched over to 4 10 hour days. So now I work Mon-Thurs:).

Mika


Nice.. looks like we were pretty close on our picks if you go by the first practice session.. Piquet stalled out our something.. not sure he or Bourdais will do much this year though..

Dana

[Mika]

What a crazy race. Ferrari's reliability is going down the crapper. Massa has gearbox issues during the weekend, Kimi's fuel pump waves bye bye during practice, Kimi's car drops the big chalupa during the race. 6 Ferrari cars= zero points. Looks like Kimi is giving Lewis 9 or 10 points in the DC fight. Hats off to Lewis for keeping focused amidst all the crazyness.



Mika

[dboat]

What a crazy race. Ferrari's reliability is going down the crapper. Massa has gearbox issues during the weekend, Kimi's fuel pump waves bye bye during practice, Kimi's car drops the big chalupa during the race. 6 Ferrari cars= zero points. Looks like Kimi is giving Lewis 9 or 10 points in the DC fight. Hats off to Lewis for keeping focused amidst all the crazyness.

Mika

I have got to re-watch the race today.. I fell asleep, which I knew I would do in the recliner at 1a in the morning.. I wake up with about 15 laps to go and over half the field is gone.. then Rubens leaves the pits under the red light, Bourdais was in fourth:eek2:, Alonso drives like a wildman and Kov lets him by twice. Kimi car craps out, Bourdais' car craps out, Glock has a spectacular wreck, etc etc.. I need to watch this one again to see what all happened..

Dana

[dboat]

Ok, I rewatched the race on the DVR this morning.. what a f'd up race.. really.. Coultard is just an idiot.. and how many cars crapped out? a ton of them.. I do have to give some props to one of my most hated drivers, Alonso, he did drive pretty good.. but what happened at the end with Kov? wtf? he drives past Alonso and then lets him pass him right back?
Oh, and they better DQ Barrichello...
I know that Hamilton got a jump on Kimi but at least its only the first race and look at what happened last year..

On to Malaysia this week.. one of my most favorite racetracks to see.. I love the look of the stands.. But I am really interested in Singapore and see how night racing will be..

Oh, did you hear them say that the Aussie GP is in trouble.. Bernie says you gotta make it a night race, but they lost $34M last year that the state made up.. wow, wonder how long it will be before they are gone from there and on to the next venue willing to pony up the $$ to Bernie and company?

Dana

[Mika]

What really irks me is the fact that Schumi went 160 races in a Ferrari before a mechanical failure. Kimi's 1st season, he has 3. If Tex still was here, he'd find a way to blame Kimi for the fuel pump failure(and motor failure in the race):D. If Ferrari can keep a car together, Kimi will be in the hunt. Otherwise, it's going to be a Lewis/Alonso showdown, and I would gladly root for Lewis. Alonso is a whiny ass. A hell of a driver, but a whiny ass.



Mika

[dboat]

What really irks me is the fact that Schumi went 160 races in a Ferrari before a mechanical failure. Kimi's 1st season, he has 3. If Tex still was here, he'd find a way to blame Kimi for the fuel pump failure(and motor failure in the race):D. If Ferrari can keep a car together, Kimi will be in the hunt. Otherwise, it's going to be a Lewis/Alonso showdown, and I would gladly root for Lewis. Alonso is a whiny ass. A hell of a driver, but a whiny ass.

Mika

Ok, I would rather root for Button, Massa, freakin' Sato before I would root for Alonso.. not sure I am a Lewis fan just yet either.. But props to BMW and Williams, honestly, if Naki.... wouldnt have run into Kubica, he might have been up on the podium.. the other teams are getting better, but there are still some drivers out there that are only there because of there heritage and not because they earned it.. and I will let it go at that..
Well, remember when Schumie left so did Ross Braun.. the Honda's did well today and I would be on the lookout for them..

Dana

[Mika]

Kimi takes the win, Kubica takes 2nd?!?!?(good for him, seriously), and Heikki goes 3rd! I really can't complain as far as that goes. It was another race that I missed though, as I was down in San Antonio. Lewis in 5th and Alonso in 8th. It'd only be a complete weekend if Massa stayed on track....



Mika

[dboat]

Kimi takes the win, Kubica takes 2nd?!?!?(good for him, seriously), and Heikki goes 3rd! I really can't complain as far as that goes. It was another race that I missed though, as I was down in San Antonio. Lewis in 5th and Alonso in 8th. It'd only be a complete weekend if Massa stayed on track....
Mika

I got up at 2:30a this morning and watched it live.. it was a great race.. I didnt know if you knew about the 5 place penalty on McLaren.. then at the start of the race Lewis jumped up to 5th place, but had a disaster of a 1st pit stop to put him back to 11th.. Massa just messed up and slid off the track into the gravel and got stuck.. he and Kimi were burning it up.. after he was gone, Kimi slowed down about a second a lap.. He was fantastic.. and two Finns on the podium.. cant complain about that.. when was the last time that happened?
Kimi makes up a lot of the space on Lewis and is tied for second in points.. the season should prove to be interesting..

Dana

[Mark #2]

I watched it today, thought it was boring.
Was there a pass after the first lap on the track?
I missed it.

[Mika]

I got up at 2:30a this morning and watched it live.. it was a great race.. I didnt know if you knew about the 5 place penalty on McLaren.. then at the start of the race Lewis jumped up to 5th place, but had a disaster of a 1st pit stop to put him back to 11th.. Massa just messed up and slid off the track into the gravel and got stuck.. he and Kimi were burning it up.. after he was gone, Kimi slowed down about a second a lap.. He was fantastic.. and two Finns on the podium.. cant complain about that.. when was the last time that happened?
Kimi makes up a lot of the space on Lewis and is tied for second in points.. the season should prove to be interesting..

Dana

The last time that 2 Finns on a podium could have happened was early/mid 90's. Mika Hakkinen and Mika Salo. I can't remember if they drove during the same time or not though...

I'm glad that Kimi caught up on Lewis. It should be a fight to the end(again). I think Alonso will be up there, but he'll still be a ways away from Hamilton and Kimi.


Mika

[dboat]

I watched it today, thought it was boring.
Was there a pass after the first lap on the track?
I missed it.

There were several, but the local broadcast of it didnt show them all.. you can see by the chart towards the end who moved up and down from start to finish.. There wasnt a lot of passing at the front because Kimi was smoking all of them.. Had he stayed on his earlier pace, he probably would have lapped most of the field. But there was a fair amount of passing amongst the rest of the field.

Dana

[dboat]

The last time that 2 Finns on a podium could have happened was early/mid 90's. Mika Hakkinen and Mika Salo. I can't remember if they drove during the same time or not though...

I'm glad that Kimi caught up on Lewis. It should be a fight to the end(again). I think Alonso will be up there, but he'll still be a ways away from Hamilton and Kimi.


Mika

I do think you have to give Alonso some props for driving that Renault as well as he does. It isnt a great car. They got by with that adjustable dampening for a few years that got him a couple of championships, but now that it is banned, they just arent in the same league. BMW is moving up and so it Toyota. And if Toyota wasnt moving up, they would be moving out.
Dana

[Mika]

I do think you have to give Alonso some props for driving that Renault as well as he does. It isnt a great car. They got by with that adjustable dampening for a few years that got him a couple of championships, but now that it is banned, they just arent in the same league. BMW is moving up and so it Toyota. And if Toyota wasnt moving up, they would be moving out.
Dana

I am not denying his driving capabilities, but as a character in F1, he's the very last person I'd root for. I'd root for Crash course Takuma before I rooted for Alonso. I am glad to see BMW up there, as well as Toyota.



Mika

[dboat]

I am not denying his driving capabilities, but as a character in F1, he's the very last person I'd root for. I'd root for Crash course Takuma before I rooted for Alonso. I am glad to see BMW up there, as well as Toyota.

Mika

me too.. I thought that Nakajima (?) did fairly well, at least he is showing more than Sato at this point.. although driving for SuperFriends or Force India cant be a whole lot of fun.. It was good to hear that the new owner of Force India is investing $50M more in the team to get them competitive. So that should make it a bit more interesting. And what about Red Bull, they now have to live on a budget and dont have a lot of spare parts.. wtf? its not like you didnt know that F1 is a bit on the expensive side of life.

Oh, did you hear them talking about how the Aussie GP may be going away? But they are building tracks in Russia, India, and UAE.. so they may not really care all that much.. apparently the Aussie govt had to put $34M into the race last year. I do know that one of the races in Germany will be going away too.

Dana

[dboat]

Since paddle shifters came from Formula One and have made their way into several cars, maybe this will help spur development of this type into performance vehicles as well.

BMW Motorsport Director Mario Theissen believes the adoption of Kinetic Energy Recovery Systems (KERS) next year will see Formula One racing assume a leading role in the advancement of hybrid technologies for everyday road cars.

From the start of next season, the Formula One regulations allow for the use of brake energy regeneration systems to increase the output and efficiency of the cars. Like the majority of their rivals, BMW Sauber are working flat out on their KERS, but Theissen feels it will be not just the F1 drivers who benefit, but also the average motorist.

“At BMW we have always used the Formula One project as a technology laboratory for series production - with KERS this approach takes on a whole new dimension,” said Theissen. “KERS will see Formula One take on a pioneering role for series production technologies going forward.

“F1 will give a baptism of fire to innovative concepts whose service life and reliability have not yet reached the level required for series production vehicles, and their development will be driven forward at full speed.”

KERS will enable the regeneration and storage of braking energy, which will then be available on tap as an extra source of power under acceleration to complement the output of a Formula One car’s V8 engine. Flexibility in the regulations will allow for either electric or mechanical solutions, with BMW Sauber opting for the former.

The 2009 BMW Sauber F1.09 will be equipped with a hybrid system consisting of a combination of electric motor and generator, the requisite power electronics and an energy storage module. In accordance with the regulations, this will store enough energy under braking to provide an additional 60 kW of output over around 6.5 seconds of acceleration.

BMW already use a brake energy regeneration system in a large number of their production cars. Although their Formula One KERS will not be dissimilar in principle, its efficiency and packaging - the complete system will weigh under 40 kg - should be in a different league.

“We are standing at the threshold between a conventional package of engine and independent transmission and an integrated drive system. The power density of the KERS components will far exceed that of today’s hybrid vehicles,” added Theissen.

[dboat]

But at least this is coming to a close, except for Nigel...

Ferrari and McLaren both issued statements on Friday confirming that the teams have agreed to settle their outstanding differences over the spying controversy that dominated the Formula One headlines in the latter half of last season.

McLaren were fined $100 million and stripped of their 2007 constructors’ points after the FIA concluded they had benefitted from the acquisition of leaked Ferrari data. McLaren have now agreed to also pay Ferrari’s costs relating to the matter, as well as a concluding payment, which Ferrari will donate to charity.

The FIA formally drew a line under the ‘Spygate’ affair last December after McLaren issued a public apology and agreed not to pursue the development of certain systems on their Formula One cars. Friday’s statements now signal the end of the few remaining issues between the two teams.

Ferrari still plan to continue legal proceedings against former employee Nigel Stepney, the engineer alleged to have passed the confidential information to McLaren.

McLaren’s statement:
"In light of the formal closure in December 2007 of the FIA and FIA World Motor Sport Council proceedings against McLaren, and of McLaren's public apology to Ferrari which we have reiterated, Ferrari and McLaren have agreed to bring the various disputes between them in relation to this matter to a final conclusion.

"McLaren has also agreed to the reimbursement of Ferrari's costs and expenses relating to these matters and a concluding payment."

Ferrari’s statement:
"Ferrari acknowledges McLaren's reiterated apology for the well known events which occurred during the 2007 F1 Championship and, in the best interests of Formula One and taking into account the formal closure in December 2007 of the FIA and FIA World Motor Sport Council proceedings against McLaren, it confirms that it has accepted to put an end to all outstanding controversies between the two teams. Ferrari will donate to charity the concluding payment received from McLaren.

"Ferrari will pursue its claims against Nigel Stepney in connection with the matter."

[Mika]

It's been a pretty interesting year so far. Lewis, Felipe and Kimi all in it to win it. All 3 tied with 48 points. Still got quite a few races left, and plenty of chances for Ferrari to blow it.



Mika

[dboat]

Still got quite a few races left, and plenty of chances for Ferrari to blow it.
Mika

You had to go and say that!!! well, lets see if Kimi can pull it out before the season is over, unless Massa shows him up...

Dana

[Mika]

Massa can get good, but you know what? He can also get bad. Kimi does relatively well, relatively consistently. When his car holds up, he's in the points. I will give Massa this. He's gotten more consistent than in years past. I think that it's going to be between Kimi and Lewis, with the edge going to Lewis. He's got too much British bias to give him the edge over Kimi.



Mika

[dboat]

Massa can get good, but you know what? He can also get bad. Kimi does relatively well, relatively consistently. When his car holds up, he's in the points. I will give Massa this. He's gotten more consistent than in years past. I think that it's going to be between Kimi and Lewis, with the edge going to Lewis. He's got too much British bias to give him the edge over Kimi.



Mika

I was thinking that your McLaren bias was showing.. I miss MS, but Kimi has done well. Massa isnt going to win the DC, but Kimi can.. I think Lewis can but I have reservations about him when the pressure is really on and really high. Kimi keeps his cool.. I think Kimi will win his second DC and then retire.. Then Sebastian Vettel moves to Ferrari..

Dana

[Mika]

Perhaps Alonso moving to Ferrari in a few years? There's been talk of him going to the Scuderia. He very well could be a Kimi replacement, as he has spoken of retiring soon.

As far as McLaren bias going...I'll root for any team other than Ferrari, unless Kimi's behind the wheel;). It just seems odd that things go awry when a Finn is behind the wheel, but when MS was behind the wheel, zero motor problems/exhaust issues/gearbox issues/etc.



Mika

[dboat]

Perhaps Alonso moving to Ferrari in a few years? There's been talk of him going to the Scuderia. He very well could be a Kimi replacement, as he has spoken of retiring soon.

As far as McLaren bias going...I'll root for any team other than Ferrari, unless Kimi's behind the wheel;). It just seems odd that things go awry when a Finn is behind the wheel, but when MS was behind the wheel, zero motor problems/exhaust issues/gearbox issues/etc.


Mika

What about HK? I think he has some game in him too.. I really dont see Alonso going to Ferrari, they wont deal with his personality as others would. They dont need to since they have consistently fielded a more than competitive car for years (barring an inequity in tire performance). So my best guess is that they will stay away from him. However, they will go after most anyone else that shows great talent.

If you recall, MS was a mechanic before he became a driver. I think he knew more about his car than most drivers and knew when to baby it and when he could push the snot out of it. He spent more time with his mechanics than most drivers as well. He was the penultimate F1 driver of all time.. IMHO (and many others) :bows

Dana

[Mika]

What about HK? I think he has some game in him too.. I really dont see Alonso going to Ferrari, they wont deal with his personality as others would. They dont need to since they have consistently fielded a more than competitive car for years (barring an inequity in tire performance). So my best guess is that they will stay away from him. However, they will go after most anyone else that shows great talent.

If you recall, MS was a mechanic before he became a driver. I think he knew more about his car than most drivers and knew when to baby it and when he could push the snot out of it. He spent more time with his mechanics than most drivers as well. He was the penultimate F1 driver of all time.. IMHO (and many others) :bows

Dana

I'm not gonna say anything good/bad about Heikki. I like him(slight foreign bias), but I still think he has a bit to learn about consistency.

I don't remember where I read it, but some folks actually think that Alonso to Ferrari is a done deal for '09 or when Kimi retires.

I wasn't trying to take away from Michael. I respected him as a driver. As far as a teacher, not so much. He's guiding Massa, but refuses to help Kimi. Which is one reason why I don't think he wanted Kimi next to him. As far as Schumi being a mechanic, that would make sense. BUT, do you think Michael would have been able to save his exhaust pipe from flying off halfway through a race, like Kimi's did? That's just one example, but I think you know the point I'm driving. The mechanics aren't trying as hard, it seems to me. Kimi's had more failures in his first year or two with Ferrari than Michael did during his tenure(not sure on numbers, but it SEEMS to be this way). Circular logic, and it could go either way.


Mika

[dboat]

I'm not gonna say anything good/bad about Heikki. I like him(slight foreign bias), but I still think he has a bit to learn about consistency.

I don't remember where I read it, but some folks actually think that Alonso to Ferrari is a done deal for '09 or when Kimi retires.

I wasn't trying to take away from Michael. I respected him as a driver. As far as a teacher, not so much. He's guiding Massa, but refuses to help Kimi. Which is one reason why I don't think he wanted Kimi next to him. As far as Schumi being a mechanic, that would make sense. BUT, do you think Michael would have been able to save his exhaust pipe from flying off halfway through a race, like Kimi's did? That's just one example, but I think you know the point I'm driving. The mechanics aren't trying as hard, it seems to me. Kimi's had more failures in his first year or two with Ferrari than Michael did during his tenure(not sure on numbers, but it SEEMS to be this way). Circular logic, and it could go either way.


Mika

I hear ya, but MS always said and acted as if it was the "team" that won and lost. He was closer to those guys than Kimi is, I think that is pretty clear, I dont know if they work less hard for Kimi or not.. but you make a compelling argument. Would Kimi take "lessons" from MS? I think not. I do think that MS probably felt he was pushed out somewhat by Kimi. Ferrari saw the window of opportunity when Kimi's contract was ending and MS was waining on whether to leave or not. So Ferrari took action, like it or not. It has panned out for them since Kimi won the DC last year and Ferrari won the CC.
I want Kimi to win the DC. When we were in Indy for the last race, we got to see more of him and realized that he really isnt so much the "Iceman". So Kim and I pull for he and Massa. Actually, the two of them seemed to really get along in the time we saw them together.
Which brings me to the fact that we are sad that F1 doesnt race here anymore. We really enjoyed our days at the racetrack, pre race and raceday. We wouldnt care what city it was in, it was just a good time to be there.. oh well..
We are saving the pennies to try to make it to Monaco to watch the race there sometime. That would be a real experience.

Dana

[Mika]

I hear ya, but MS always said and acted as if it was the "team" that won and lost. He was closer to those guys than Kimi is, I think that is pretty clear, I dont know if they work less hard for Kimi or not.. but you make a compelling argument. Would Kimi take "lessons" from MS? I think not. I do think that MS probably felt he was pushed out somewhat by Kimi. Ferrari saw the window of opportunity when Kimi's contract was ending and MS was waining on whether to leave or not. So Ferrari took action, like it or not. It has panned out for them since Kimi won the DC last year and Ferrari won the CC.
I want Kimi to win the DC. When we were in Indy for the last race, we got to see more of him and realized that he really isnt so much the "Iceman". So Kim and I pull for he and Massa. Actually, the two of them seemed to really get along in the time we saw them together.
Which brings me to the fact that we are sad that F1 doesnt race here anymore. We really enjoyed our days at the racetrack, pre race and raceday. We wouldnt care what city it was in, it was just a good time to be there.. oh well..
We are saving the pennies to try to make it to Monaco to watch the race there sometime. That would be a real experience.

Dana

Schumi did have a great relationship with his team, no doubt. Kimi's learning from MS's public relations though. Last race he said that the team made the wrong choice in tires(staying on the same tires instead of swapping). Which could be interpreted two ways...either he didn't want to admit fault, or he didn't want to pin fault on the boss. He accepted the fact that he's the main PR guy, and was willing to take part of the blame. I think it's a step in the right direction. It's still a ways away from MS, but it's a step in the right direction. I agree that Michael was probably pushed out by Kimi(seize the moment Ferrari did). I'd like to think that Kimi would take lessons from MS...anyone with half a mind would listen avidly to what he has to say(MS's records will stand for quite some time). But a lot of times pride does cloud judgement.

Indy...*sigh*. It makes me cry. The last time I went was in '06(or was it '05 with only 6 cars out there?), and I refuse to go back. Sad part is that I went from '00 to '05(or '06). That is one assbackwards town, and that's coming from someone who lives in Texas:eek:. If anyone says there aren't rednecks north of the Mason Dixon, they're full of it.

My parents went to Catalunya in '05 or so...they said they really, really liked it. Good view of the track, tickets weren't terrible($200/each), and the culture was a nice one.

As far as going to Monaco, that'd be awesome, but I feel that you wouldn't be able to enjoy the race that much(viewing is iffy at best, unless you're gripping some serious coin). I'd make a guess that you're aware of this though.

If I had a choice at going to an F1 race, I'd think Japan. Seeing a completely different culture and watching a race(quite possibly in a monsoon) would be great to me. Of course I could be missing something(besides the $$$$ to get there:tongue: )


Mika

[dboat]

Schumi did have a great relationship with his team, no doubt. Kimi's learning from MS's public relations though. Last race he said that the team made the wrong choice in tires(staying on the same tires instead of swapping). Which could be interpreted two ways...either he didn't want to admit fault, or he didn't want to pin fault on the boss. He accepted the fact that he's the main PR guy, and was willing to take part of the blame. I think it's a step in the right direction. It's still a ways away from MS, but it's a step in the right direction. I agree that Michael was probably pushed out by Kimi(seize the moment Ferrari did). I'd like to think that Kimi would take lessons from MS...anyone with half a mind would listen avidly to what he has to say(MS's records will stand for quite some time). But a lot of times pride does cloud judgement.

Indy...*sigh*. It makes me cry. The last time I went was in '06(or was it '05 with only 6 cars out there?), and I refuse to go back. Sad part is that I went from '00 to '05(or '06). That is one assbackwards town, and that's coming from someone who lives in Texas:eek:. If anyone says there aren't rednecks north of the Mason Dixon, they're full of it.

My parents went to Catalunya in '05 or so...they said they really, really liked it. Good view of the track, tickets weren't terrible($200/each), and the culture was a nice one.

As far as going to Monaco, that'd be awesome, but I feel that you wouldn't be able to enjoy the race that much(viewing is iffy at best, unless you're gripping some serious coin). I'd make a guess that you're aware of this though.

If I had a choice at going to an F1 race, I'd think Japan. Seeing a completely different culture and watching a race(quite possibly in a monsoon) would be great to me. Of course I could be missing something(besides the $$$$ to get there:tongue: )


Mika

You go to Monaco for the view but not necessarily that of the cars:evil

We would have to make it a two week affair.. you spend enough time at the track but would have to go to several other countries as well.. and gamble at least one time in the Casino.. heck you have to pay admission just to go in there.. it would be some serious coin, but hopefully would be a trip you would remember forever..

Maybe you can answer me why Kimi is looking to retire so soon? He has said that he would be happy with two DC's, just like Mika H. I would think that he just might run out of money faster than he thinks. Does he live in Finland and pay those kind of taxes?

Dana

[Mika]

Ah, I see your motive to go to Monaco now. Understood completely. Plus you could get to travel quite a bit and do some sightsseeing.

There were rumors of Kimi retiring at the beginning of the season. I think it could have something to do with everything wearing him down. He had 5 or 6 years at McLaren, and that takes its toll right there. Now there's pressure for him to step into Michael's shoes, something that nobody will be able to do. That topped with the reliability issue(it's not as much of an issue as it was with McLaren) and it's quite a bit of pressure. I wouldn't be too concerned with money if I were in Kimi's shoes. His official residency is in Monaco, which is what a lot of F1 driver's do. The taxes are much lower there than in the rest of Europe.



Mika

[dboat]

Ah, I see your motive to go to Monaco now. Understood completely. Plus you could get to travel quite a bit and do some sightsseeing.

There were rumors of Kimi retiring at the beginning of the season. I think it could have something to do with everything wearing him down. He had 5 or 6 years at McLaren, and that takes its toll right there. Now there's pressure for him to step into Michael's shoes, something that nobody will be able to do. That topped with the reliability issue(it's not as much of an issue as it was with McLaren) and it's quite a bit of pressure. I wouldn't be too concerned with money if I were in Kimi's shoes. His official residency is in Monaco, which is what a lot of F1 driver's do. The taxes are much lower there than in the rest of Europe.

Mika

Ah yes, Monaco, the home of no taxes... There are rumors of Kubica going to Ferrari too.. and his contract is coming up. He might make a good match there too.. I am not sure anyone outside of Renault wants Alonso.. too high maintenance.

Dana

[Mika]

I used to like Alonso, 'til all hell broke loose with him and he turned into a whiny crybaby. I think Kubica would be a good fit for Ferrari, except the fact that he doesn't have Latino blood(Italian, Brazilian, Spaniard). But tha'ts just me;).



Mika

[dboat]

I used to like Alonso, 'til all hell broke loose with him and he turned into a whiny crybaby. I think Kubica would be a good fit for Ferrari, except the fact that he doesn't have Latino blood(Italian, Brazilian, Spaniard). But tha'ts just me;).

Mika

Oh, I hear ya on that one.. but since a German got along so well, I am thinking a Pole can do it too.. at least I hope so.. he is a guy you can like although his on air personality isnt overwhelming.. although I hear he hangs around the pits and plays poker with the team.. good move on his part as long as he doesnt win too often...

[Mika]

Lewis on pole, Massa in third, and Kimi sixth. Looks like Lewis is going to take a stronger lead in the race for DC.

I do believe that Kubica can make it at Ferrari. But I think that Montezemolo(sp!) would rather have someone closer to their character as a driver, versus a Finn or a German. Not that either are bad(quite the opposite), but the fit for the team would be much better.


Mika

[dboat]

Lewis on pole, Massa in third, and Kimi sixth. Looks like Lewis is going to take a stronger lead in the race for DC.

I do believe that Kubica can make it at Ferrari. But I think that Montezemolo(sp!) would rather have someone closer to their character as a driver, versus a Finn or a German. Not that either are bad(quite the opposite), but the fit for the team would be much better.

Mika

I was watching it this morning and just couldnt believe it.. Kimi was third, then fourth, then fifth, then sixth.. those other guys have to be running an incredibly light load of fuel.. his time just wasnt that bad.. but Massa and Lewis were quick. It was good to see MS on the screen again.. I agree with the commentators, I wouldnt be surprised to see him in a car again, 24hr of Le Mans, or something like that.. wonder if it would be beneath him to make a one time run at the Indy 500?

Dana

[Mika]

Lewis took care of business, as I expected. I see too much momentum going for him, and fading away from Kimi/Massa/Ferrari. I'm not throwing in the towel, but when Kimi didn't get any kind of decent laps until the last 1/3rd of the race, something's up. And I seriously suspect that a lot of it has to do with Montezemolo getting rid of most of the crew and putting Italians in place. :nono:




Mika

[dboat]

Lewis took care of business, as I expected. I see too much momentum going for him, and fading away from Kimi/Massa/Ferrari. I'm not throwing in the towel, but when Kimi didn't get any kind of decent laps until the last 1/3rd of the race, something's up. And I seriously suspect that a lot of it has to do with Montezemolo getting rid of most of the crew and putting Italians in place. :nono:

Mika

I didnt know that he had destructed so much of the team that MS and others had put together.. I am afraid you are correct.. then there may be some dark days for Ferrari ahead.. although, what has changed at McLaren in regard to them becoming so reliable as of last year? when Kimi was there, it seemed he always always getting bitten by the dnf demon.

Dana

[Mika]

I didnt know that he had destructed so much of the team that MS and others had put together.. I am afraid you are correct.. then there may be some dark days for Ferrari ahead.. although, what has changed at McLaren in regard to them becoming so reliable as of last year? when Kimi was there, it seemed he always always getting bitten by the dnf demon.

Dana


If I had to take a guess, I'd say that McLaren took more info than they admitted to, including other parts of Ferrari. They admitted to spying on some parts and not advancing the aspects of their spying(ie...aero package, etc).

I find it odd as well that McLaren suddenly found pace AND reliability after MS retired. The previous seasons the reliability may have been there for the Macca, but the speed wasn't. And if the speed was there, reliability wasn't. Now they've got both. I may be a little :tex, but I think there's a whole lot more going on behind the scenes than Macca and Ferrari may admit.



Mika

[dboat]

I think there's a whole lot more going on behind the scenes than Macca and Ferrari may admit. Mika

I couldnt have said it better myself.. and then there are the rest of the also rans.. although, I am wondering if the top two teams are moving down or the other teams are slowing moving up.. they are changing too many variables to be able to compare the old vs the new.. however, did you see some of the old vids of races from just 8 yrs ago and how square the cars looked compared to the current ones.. wow, how technology has changed these cars..

Dana

[Mika]

From what I've seen this season so far, Ferrari has either stayed the same, or perhaps taken a small step back, while McLaren has moved up quite a bit(with regards to both speed and reliability). BMW is moving ahead as well. Toyota, not so much(can't tell with those drivers). I seriously feel that this year is the year of the McLaren.

Looking back you are absolutely right. I never thought about it 'til you said it, but those cars are so dang squared compared to the cars of these days. Guess that windtunnel helps out :).



Mika

[Mika]

Ferrari's "reliability" rears its ugly head yet once again. 3 laps left, motor goes Blammo for Massa. Glad Kimi was able to limp it home though. Good race for Heikki. He deserved the win. Lewis botched up his race with the flat spot. Deserves what he got.



Mika

[dboat]

Ferrari's "reliability" rears its ugly head yet once again. 3 laps left, motor goes Blammo for Massa. Glad Kimi was able to limp it home though. Good race for Heikki. He deserved the win. Lewis botched up his race with the flat spot. Deserves what he got.

Mika

What a wild race today in so many ways..

An unusual Ferrari DNF, too bad for Massa, he is just not a lucky guy at times. (note: I recall one race where Mika H had his McLaren go on him on the last lap once too) But now things will tighten up again and it just goes to show you that you best not count your chickens before they hatch.

Heikki showed his stuff today and kept his car on pace and together. What about Timo? nice finish for the virtual rookie.. good for him.. And what about all the news of Honda openly courting Alonso and saying that they would be competitive now if he were driving. What a slap to Button and RB!! Which one of those will be let go if Alonso does go to Honda?

And I guess that Kimi was just keeping pace with Alonso to keep it together to Finnish (:D) the race.. but clearly took advantage of the one lap difference in pit stop to pass Alonso. He was so fast at the end, (did he end up with fastest lap) but could only get third. Of course that third came at the expense of Massa getting first..

Lastly, I was screaming and cheering at the start.. what a GREAT GREAT start by Massa.. it was incredible.. too bad it was wasted..

I wont be able to watch the next race live since I will be out of town bear hunting.. but it will definitely be on the DVR.. a brand new race at a new venue and through the streets.. should be great fun.

Dana

[Mika]

What a wild race today in so many ways..

An unusual Ferrari DNF, too bad for Massa, he is just not a lucky guy at times. (note: I recall one race where Mika H had his McLaren go on him on the last lap once too) But now things will tighten up again and it just goes to show you that you best not count your chickens before they hatch.

Heikki showed his stuff today and kept his car on pace and together. What about Timo? nice finish for the virtual rookie.. good for him.. And what about all the news of Honda openly courting Alonso and saying that they would be competitive now if he were driving. What a slap to Button and RB!! Which one of those will be let go if Alonso does go to Honda?

And I guess that Kimi was just keeping pace with Alonso to keep it together to Finnish (:D) the race.. but clearly took advantage of the one lap difference in pit stop to pass Alonso. He was so fast at the end, (did he end up with fastest lap) but could only get third. Of course that third came at the expense of Massa getting first..

Lastly, I was screaming and cheering at the start.. what a GREAT GREAT start by Massa.. it was incredible.. too bad it was wasted..

I wont be able to watch the next race live since I will be out of town bear hunting.. but it will definitely be on the DVR.. a brand new race at a new venue and through the streets.. should be great fun.

Dana

Yup, Hakk lost his motor on the last lap...it may have been the last corner even...crying shame. That's the McLaren that I'm used to seeing. Not used to seeing them stay together and have pace throughout the whole race.

Timo was at the right place at the right time. He did well last weekend as well. I don't think his past few results are flukes. But if he is to make a good push for the chase, he'll have to remain in the top 5. He's doing a really good job.

As far as Honda going for Alonso, it cracks me up. I think the Japanese folks finally figured out that they aren't going to win with a Japanese driver. It's good to see them going after a winner(although a whiney one). Jenson hasn't done much, and neither has Rubens. I think out of those two Rubens would be out. He doesn't have too many more years left, while Button's still young(er). I think it can be seen as a slap in the face, but also as a fire under the current drivers' asses.

2 Finns on the same podium. It's been a while since that has happened...has it ever happened?



Mika

[dboat]

Yup, Hakk lost his motor on the last lap...it may have been the last corner even...crying shame. That's the McLaren that I'm used to seeing. Not used to seeing them stay together and have pace throughout the whole race.

Timo was at the right place at the right time. He did well last weekend as well. I don't think his past few results are flukes. But if he is to make a good push for the chase, he'll have to remain in the top 5. He's doing a really good job.

As far as Honda going for Alonso, it cracks me up. I think the Japanese folks finally figured out that they aren't going to win with a Japanese driver. It's good to see them going after a winner(although a whiney one). Jenson hasn't done much, and neither has Rubens. I think out of those two Rubens would be out. He doesn't have too many more years left, while Button's still young(er). I think it can be seen as a slap in the face, but also as a fire under the current drivers' asses.

2 Finns on the same podium. It's been a while since that has happened...has it ever happened?

Mika

Thats a good question on two Finn's? I really dont know.. hmmm..

I do have to begrudingly agree that Alonso is a really good driver.. look at what he gets out of that pig of a car he is driving now.. what has happened to that team? They were the toast of F1 just a few years ago and now they are lucky to finish in the top ten.. Oh, and what is happening at BMW? they have really fallen off only to see Toyota really step it up..

I like Rubens due to his former Ferrari time, although if he had been smart, being a #2 to MS is a better deal than being #1 or #2 at Honda.. IMHO. However, I have always liked Button and wanted him to do well. I would go with Button just because of youth and attitude. Not sure Rubens and Alonso would get along well in the paddock..

Dana

[dboat]

Interesting track conditions today, but not too much so for Spa. Kimi has his back to the wall in regads to needing to win to stay in the hunt for the DC. Massa may upstage him and replace him as the number 1 driver for the team.. who'd a thunk that would happen?

Hamilton is looking strong and so is McLaren.
But what a good showing by Toro Rosso Ferrari with Bourdais and Vettel.. good for them.. nice to see a new face(s) in Q3..

Dana

[dboat]

Apparently, Bernie Ecclestone has announed to the teams that a deal is being struck to bring F1 back to the US in 2010. While he didnt say where, he did say they were looking at 2-3 places.. knanaknana

This is great news for those of us that are F1 fans.. I really did like Indy as it is one great place to watch a race for a fan... to be honest, having covered seats so that you dont get beat down by the sun for hours is one of my top reasons to go there. :tu:

Dana

[Mika]

Interesting track conditions today, but not too much so for Spa. Kimi has his back to the wall in regads to needing to win to stay in the hunt for the DC. Massa may upstage him and replace him as the number 1 driver for the team.. who'd a thunk that would happen?

Hamilton is looking strong and so is McLaren.
But what a good showing by Toro Rosso Ferrari with Bourdais and Vettel.. good for them.. nice to see a new face(s) in Q3..

Dana

Massa will probably be #1 driver at Ferrari. I wouldn't be surprised if Kimi retired. Schumacher's helping Massa out, but not Kimi. Massa's manager is also a son of a higher up at Ferrari(can't remember who now). I'm not sure if Kimi's got a lot left in the tank. I think he'll be there at Ferrari 'til his contract is up, and then retire.

I didn't watch the race, had a late hockey game last night(beer league), so I slept in and then helped a buddy of mine today. But from what I've read, Kimi blew it. Can't put the blame on anyone else besides himself.

As far as the USGP goes, I hope it's not Indy. I don't care for that town, honestly. Not a whole lot to do there, and the F1 venue is considered a step child to the almighty Indy 500/Brickyard races. I'd like to see a road course like Laguna Seca, but I don't think that place has the capacity to hold an F1 event(spectators, pits, etc). I'm not going to hold my breathe either as far as F1 coming to the US. F1/FIA scammed us in '05(or '06?) when they only raced 6 cars. Screw me once, shame on you, screw me twice, shame on me.



Mika

[dboat]

Massa will probably be #1 driver at Ferrari. I wouldn't be surprised if Kimi retired. Schumacher's helping Massa out, but not Kimi. Massa's manager is also a son of a higher up at Ferrari(can't remember who now). I'm not sure if Kimi's got a lot left in the tank. I think he'll be there at Ferrari 'til his contract is up, and then retire.

I didn't watch the race, had a late hockey game last night(beer league), so I slept in and then helped a buddy of mine today. But from what I've read, Kimi blew it. Can't put the blame on anyone else besides himself.

As far as the USGP goes, I hope it's not Indy. I don't care for that town, honestly. Not a whole lot to do there, and the F1 venue is considered a step child to the almighty Indy 500/Brickyard races. I'd like to see a road course like Laguna Seca, but I don't think that place has the capacity to hold an F1 event(spectators, pits, etc). I'm not going to hold my breathe either as far as F1 coming to the US. F1/FIA scammed us in '05(or '06?) when they only raced 6 cars. Screw me once, shame on you, screw me twice, shame on me.

Mika

I think you are right about Kimi's "fire in the belly". He has won a DC and probably has a lot of money in the bank.. However, when he is no longer a driver, he will be living in a different world. But maybe he is just tired of living under the microscope that is F1.
My best guess is that Indy is going to be considered as a venue, just because its Indy.. Laguna Seca would be great, but would need a large infusion of cash to upgrade the facilities. But watching the F1 cars going through the corkscrew would just be amazing.. get me a seat right there..
Yes, FIA and the other race teams, tire manufacturer and others screwed us with the 6 car race, I was there, but we still keep coming back, because nothing else is F1. If it happened again to me, it would be the last time.. kind of like MLB and the strikes by the players.
I dont know if Kimi "blew it" I think he was driving hard, got passed and tried to get his position back, in the rain on dry tires.. it could have happened the other way around too.. maybe he should have backed off and taken second, but at least he fought hard to get his position back. I watched the race and enjoyed it.. I was screaming at the beginning and at the end..

Dana

[dboat]

Hamilton was assessed a 25 second penalty and has been moved to finishing 3rd from 1st.. that means that Massa and he are only 2 pts apart going into the race this weekend..

Dana

[Mika]

I think you are right about Kimi's "fire in the belly". He has won a DC and probably has a lot of money in the bank.. However, when he is no longer a driver, he will be living in a different world. But maybe he is just tired of living under the microscope that is F1.
My best guess is that Indy is going to be considered as a venue, just because its Indy.. Laguna Seca would be great, but would need a large infusion of cash to upgrade the facilities. But watching the F1 cars going through the corkscrew would just be amazing.. get me a seat right there..
Yes, FIA and the other race teams, tire manufacturer and others screwed us with the 6 car race, I was there, but we still keep coming back, because nothing else is F1. If it happened again to me, it would be the last time.. kind of like MLB and the strikes by the players.
I dont know if Kimi "blew it" I think he was driving hard, got passed and tried to get his position back, in the rain on dry tires.. it could have happened the other way around too.. maybe he should have backed off and taken second, but at least he fought hard to get his position back. I watched the race and enjoyed it.. I was screaming at the beginning and at the end..

Dana

I'm curious to see what the other venues would be. I'm sure that Indy is one of them. I just hope that Bernie doesn't get too greedy again. When I went with my family, we sat in the North and NorthWest Vista. Great views(1st 8 or 9 corners, all the way from the end of the front straight to the beginning of back stretch). But the sun was ablistering. I'm about as caucasian as you can get, so I cooked.



Mika

[dboat]

I'm curious to see what the other venues would be. I'm sure that Indy is one of them. I just hope that Bernie doesn't get too greedy again. When I went with my family, we sat in the North and NorthWest Vista. Great views(1st 8 or 9 corners, all the way from the end of the front straight to the beginning of back stretch). But the sun was ablistering. I'm about as caucasian as you can get, so I cooked.
Mika

I know what you mean.. so I spent the money on the covered seating and would go back there in a heartbeat.. plus each section up there has its own concession stand and toilets.. was worth every penny..

Could be Viva Las Vegas too.. :icon_mrgreen:

[Mark #2]

I know what you mean.. so I spent the money on the covered seating and would go back there in a heartbeat.. plus each section up there has its own concession stand and toilets.. was worth every penny..

Could be Viva Las Vegas too.. :icon_mrgreen:

They came to Dallas in 1984, I helped set up the track got to drive the track in the 911 in front of them before the race and IIRC someone pushed their car across the finish line and passed out. It was like 110 that day.

They were turbo cars back then and sounded great, bring back the turbo cars and Dallas.:D

[dboat]

They came to Dallas in 1984, I helped set up the track got to drive the track in the 911 in front of them before the race and IIRC someone pushed their car across the finish line and passed out. It was like 110 that day.

They were turbo cars back then and sounded great, bring back the turbo cars and Dallas.:D

Wasnt that a street race around downtown? the roads downtown are in such bad shape, it would be prohibitively expensive, but you could easily see someone stepping up and building a track and then getting an early date to avoid the heat. Was one run in Detroit once too?

Dana

[dboat]

Kimi R signs on for another 2 years.. who'd a thunk that would happen..that means that his and Massa's contract end at the same time.. it will at least put those Alonso rumors to rest for a little while.

Dana

[dboat]

F1 releases the 2009 schedule to the public and eliminates the Canadian Gran Prix.. funny thing is, no one associated with the CGP knew about the decision and found out the same way as everyone else.. typical for F1.. :(

Even more concerning is that there is no Gran Prix in North America next year at all.. so if you want to attend, plan on traveling overseas.. :mad:

Dana

[Mika]

I can understand not having the USGP, but canceling the Canadian GP? Seriously. What the heck? Back in '04 or '05 my parents went to Spain, and they loved it. But it was also costly. The next closest race now is what, England? And I'm sure that the price will easily double/triple to that of a trip to Indy or Montreal. It is what it is, a business. Sucks to the locals, but not surprised.




Mika

[dboat]

I can understand not having the USGP, but canceling the Canadian GP? Seriously. What the heck? Back in '04 or '05 my parents went to Spain, and they loved it. But it was also costly. The next closest race now is what, England? And I'm sure that the price will easily double/triple to that of a trip to Indy or Montreal. It is what it is, a business. Sucks to the locals, but not surprised.

Mika

How much would it be to go to Brazil? actually, I wouldnt mind going to the one in Singapore or the new one in Abu Dabi (sp?) But it was so much nicer to have a one day drive to the one in Indy..

Dana

[Mika]

If I had to take a guess(and all it'd be is a WAG, not even scientific) would be around $1500-2000 per person. $800ish for flight, $200/night for 4 nights, probably $200-300 per ticket. Toss in a couple hundred for food/drinks, and that's right about $2k.



Mika

[dboat]

If I had to take a guess(and all it'd be is a WAG, not even scientific) would be around $1500-2000 per person. $800ish for flight, $200/night for 4 nights, probably $200-300 per ticket. Toss in a couple hundred for food/drinks, and that's right about $2k.

Mika

But you would be in Brazil where the real beautiful people live:tu:.. they are a good looking people.. :icon_mrgreen:

Singapore wouldnt be bad either.. I am sure someone from Talon has been to both places.. I think that Abu Dabi would be interesting since they have built those man made islands, and the gorgeous hotel made to look like a sail, etc etc.. but I would prefer the other two places first.. now, the wife wont go to Brazil but she says its because of the rampant crime, especially to American tourists.


Dana

[dboat]

What a wild race from the very beginning.. it looks like Hamilton has a fatal flaw and that is he cant make good decisions when under pressure.. He completely blew it at the beginning of the race, then he tried to get under Kimi and almost caused a huge pileup of cars in the first corner. Then his over the top try to get around Massa later caused Massa (IMHO) to bump him and spin him around.. all of this ended up getting Massa and he a drive through penalty which took Hamilton out of the points and put Massa where he ended up getting only 2 points for the day (the last point thanks to a penalty handed to Bourdais for hitting Massa). You have to admit it, and I hate to, but FA drove a great race, Kubicka and Kimi did as well, although I thought Kimi could have taken to Kubicka a bit more and finished a position higher. Had Kimi finished one position higher, he would still be in the fight for the DC.. however, the DC is now down to three drivers, Hamilton, Massa and Kubicka... These last two races should be really exciting.. at least they should mean something unless Kubicka and Massa DNF and Hamilton wins.. then it could all be over after China..

Mika, will Kimi be the good teammate and help out Massa?

Dana

[Mika]

Wow. Tough call. I think that if Kimi could help Massa out, he would. Massa helped out last season for Kimi, now it's Kimi's turn to return the favor. Don't know if he'll take Lewis out or anything like that, but I don't think he'll give up an easy pass. Lewis has been driving very aggressively, and I think Kimi won't budge(go off line) to get out of Lewis's way the next few races. So don't be surprised if Kimi shows little compassion/consideration for Lewis.

I don't think Kimi wanted to push any further than he did. He's already had awful luck the last 4 or 5 races. Not finishing in points pretty much did him in this year. He'll help Massa if need be. I think they get along ok now. Heck, they're going to need to considering they're partners for the next 2 years('til '11, right?).




Mika

[dboat]

Yep, best buds for another couple of years.. I dont think they are a bad team either..

you going to stay up to watch it on Sat night? I was nodding like crazy with the Japan GP.. hope I can make it through the Chinese one.. Brazil should be much nicer, time wise.. also, the grid girls will be prettier in Brazil too.. :tongue:

Dana

[Mika]

I may be up for it. I've been playing hockey(ice) for about 6 months now, and the games are on Saturday nights. I rarely go to sleep before 1 in the mornin', so I may be up for it. I do think Massa and Kimi are a decent team. I'd just like to see Kimi ahead;). Go figure. Definitely agree on the prettier grid. Dunno what they eat, so it must be the water down there in Brazil;).




Mika

[Mika]

Found the answer to what you were asking a few days ago, Dana(as to whether or not Kimi will help Massa out).

from formula1.com

"Kimi Raikkonen, Ferrari
2007 Qualifying - 2nd, 2007 Race - 1st
“Now we're going to China. Let's see what we can do there, where I won last year. Shanghai is a very demanding track and I really like it. Our goal is a one-two win. I'll give it all to help Felipe and the team to gain the results we want.”

I'd love to see a Ferrari 1-2 finish. I'd even say it'd be "ok" if Massa won the race;). I really want Ferrari to beat McLaren. Kimi got hosed so many years there(so close, yet so far away from multiple DC's).



Mika

[dboat]

I'd love to see a Ferrari 1-2 finish. I'd even say it'd be "ok" if Massa won the race;). I really want Ferrari to beat McLaren. Kimi got hosed so many years there(so close, yet so far away from multiple DC's).

Mika

I bet that almost hurt to say.. Kimi is my favorite driver now that MS is no longer driving, but I will be pulling for Massa too... 1-2 would be nice with McLaren finishing out of the points.. I wouldnt mind seeing Kubicka finishing the DC in the top three either..

Dana

[Mika]

I like Kubica. He wasn't given much of a chance a few years ago, but he has certainly made the most of it. Seems like a decent guy, great driving skills too.



Mika

[dboat]

Well, this is the next to last race of the season.. with Hamilton, Massa and Kimi in the first three spots, the first corner should be interesting needless to say.. Massa needs a win and to have Hamilton fall a few spots back to make it really interesting in Brazil.. what happened to Kubicka? 11th on the grid, didnt even make it into Q3... wow... FA is up in the fourth spot and is making a real run to get an even bigger contract with someone next year.. (can we say Red Bull?)

I will probably get up in the middle of the night to watch this one.. at least the start and then fall asleep in my chair..

Dana


:rolleyes: hmmm, wonder if Kimi will take out Hamilton.... wonder wonder...

[dboat]

Well, this is it.. the final race.. its down to two drivers, Hamilton and Massa. The Construtors Championship is down to Ferrari and McLaren..

McLaren is running cars with a one race old engine, Ferrari has fresh engines in their cars.. This is Massa's home track and the track where Hamilton failed to bring home the championship last year.

Massa has pole, Trulli second, Kimi third and Hamilton fourth.. Alonso, in fifth could be a wildcard.. Massa has only won when he is on the front row.. Kimi will be behind him and next to Hamilton..

This should be really interesting tomorrow.. if Hamilton finishes at least 5th or above he wins the DC, if not, then Massa has a chance.. the winning drivers family gets to wave the checkered flag.

Go Massa, take it home.. :tu:

And what the heck has happened to Kubicka in the last month or so.. Kimi has a shot at 3rd in the DC if Kubicka cant get it together.. he didnt get out of Q2 this morning.. very puzzling.

Hopefully, the Talon guys that watch F1 will have it on Speed tomorrow at noon for this, what should be a classic race..

Dana

[Mika]

Glad to see Massa take the win at home. Sorry to see Hamilton steal 5th, and the DC. Not saying that he doesn't deserve it, but he just seems to be too much of a cocky *******(pardon the French). Kimi took 3rd as DC, which is about as good as he could get. Ferrari took the CC.

I would have liked to see Massa take it, seeing as how I honestly feel that he's pushed as hard as he possibly could. It's times like these that make me wish for a #1 and a #2 from the first part of the season. Kimi and Massa take points from each other, making it easier for Lewis to gain momentum. Heikki is a good driver, but he's not as big of a threat to Lewis as Kimi is to Massa, or vice versa.

Such is life. We shall see what will happen with next year.


Mika

[dboat]

Mika, did you watch the race? it was incredible.. the title was decided just a couple of corners from the end...

Dana

I agree, with Kimi and Massa fighting for points, it was easier for Hamilton to not have to worry about his teammate so much.. Massa is the most improved driver this year.

[Mika]

Mika, did you watch the race? it was incredible.. the title was decided just a couple of corners from the end...

Dana

I agree, with Kimi and Massa fighting for points, it was easier for Hamilton to not have to worry about his teammate so much.. Massa is the most improved driver this year.

I watched the last 15 laps. I can't believe that Glock was that slow on the last lap, but I can't argue with that since he was on dry tires, while everyone else was on rain tires. Such is life. It's a huge disappointment, this whole season. One, 'cuz Kimi wasn't in it realistically for the past 4 or 5 races. Two, Hamilton won the DC. It's really, really annoying to see all the UK press kiss his butt. Last year Kimi didn't get the time of day for snatching the DC, but Lewis is God's gift to F1. Three, Max Mosley. I've lost just about all respect for F1 due to the sex scandal.

Each year F1 has less and less appeal to me. Indy '06 scandal(6 cars does not justify a race), losing Indy and now losing Montreal. Ugh. It's as if F1 doesn't want to appeal to the largest auto market in the world(well, maybe second now behind China-not sure about that). I am not in marketing for F1, so what do I know.



Mika

[dboat]

I watched the last 15 laps. I can't believe that Glock was that slow on the last lap, but I can't argue with that since he was on dry tires, while everyone else was on rain tires. Such is life. It's a huge disappointment, this whole season. One, 'cuz Kimi wasn't in it realistically for the past 4 or 5 races. Two, Hamilton won the DC. It's really, really annoying to see all the UK press kiss his butt. Last year Kimi didn't get the time of day for snatching the DC, but Lewis is God's gift to F1. Three, Max Mosley. I've lost just about all respect for F1 due to the sex scandal.

Each year F1 has less and less appeal to me. Indy '06 scandal(6 cars does not justify a race), losing Indy and now losing Montreal. Ugh. It's as if F1 doesn't want to appeal to the largest auto market in the world(well, maybe second now behind China-not sure about that). I am not in marketing for F1, so what do I know.

Mika

I agree with you 100%...also, if they do move to the same engine for everyone, that will be it for me.. also, Ferrari and Toyota have said they will leave and I would think others wouldnt be far behind. I am sure Red Bull/Toro Rosso and Force India wouldnt care since they buy their engines anyway, but it will take away the one thing that makes everyone different. Yes I know they still have their chassis and handling work, but its not a Ferrari without a Ferrari engine in it..
I really dont understand the thinking of getting rid of the races in North America. I am sure the auto companies want to be here to help them sell cars. But F1 hasnt been here very long, and then they leave, how are you supposed to build a fan base? It takes years to do this, even CrashCar wasnt built overnight..

Dana

[dboat]

The new rules are out for 2009 and I am not sure I like them but they are what they are and they intend to shave costs from F1.. I did vote over on the Formula1.com website that I did not like Bernie's idea of awarding medals for the races.. but then again, I would probably vote against anything that Bernie wants..
For those that are interested, go to the website and read the new rules for 2009.. the new good rule is that they are going back to slicks from the grooved tires.. that one I do like..

Dana

[Mark #2]

The new rules are out for 2009 and I am not sure I like them but they are what they are and they intend to shave costs from F1.. I did vote over on the Formula1.com website that I did not like Bernie's idea of awarding medals for the races.. but then again, I would probably vote against anything that Bernie wants..
For those that are interested, go to the website and read the new rules for 2009.. the new good rule is that they are going back to slicks from the grooved tires.. that one I do like..

Dana

After all these years of banning movable devices now they get two, KERS and front wing, interesting. Engine rule, will be tough in the beginning to go 3 races, tires are good.

[dboat]

After all these years of banning movable devices now they get two, KERS and front wing, interesting. Engine rule, will be tough in the beginning to go 3 races, tires are good.

I am thinking that KERS, as a race benefit and being used is still off at least another year.. but the movable wing by the driver is pretty cool... three races on an engine is going to be hard.. but I sure would like to have one of those engines after its been raced three times.. just for looks in the corner:D

oh, did you notice that they dropped max rpms to 18,000 from 19,000? I would have hoped that they would have increased it another 1,000 rpm.. dang it.

Dana

[Mark #2]

I am thinking that KERS, as a race benefit and being used is still off at least another year.. but the movable wing by the driver is pretty cool... three races on an engine is going to be hard.. but I sure would like to have one of those engines after its been raced three times.. just for looks in the corner:D

oh, did you notice that they dropped max rpms to 18,000 from 19,000? I would have hoped that they would have increased it another 1,000 rpm.. dang it.

Dana

KERS & Engines
Q: What’s the plan for running a KERS car over the winter?
Paddy Lowe: Before Christmas, we’ll be running one chassis as a KERS car - MP4-23K. We will develop the interim technology on the 23K mule car before the race system is introduced onto next year’s 24A. We’ll also have an additional 23A for running our chassis and tyre programme.

Indy Lall: For our first proper circuit test we want to make sure the device can ride kerbs and withstand a lot of the bumping that we necessarily haven’t seen in any of our previous aero tests. Equally, up to now we’ve extracted a smaller output of power from the KERS device and our step up to maximum power won’t happen instantly. We’ll build up to it.

Q: How will you develop the KERS programme during the season?
Ola Kallenius: Unlike the engine, there is full development freedom on KERS. And like any new technology it’s only natural to expect the system to develop as you learn more about it. Every team will be updating their systems during the season.

Paddy Lowe: There will definitely be constant development of the KERS device through the year. One thing to bear in mind is that the ultimate idealised performance benefit of KERS is capped - because it’s limited in power and energy. So assuming you’ve delivered to that cap, you’re looking more into the domains of doing it for less weight or doing it more efficiently or more reliably.

Q: Is there a firm plan about how best to exploit the system during races?
Paddy Lowe: Certainly, the variation from circuit to circuit will be different. Also KERS will have more authority at some tracks than at others - so the pecking order from circuit to circuit may change a little bit.

Ola Kallenius: There will certainly be different optimal strategies for different tracks.

Q: How easy is it to use KERS in the cockpit?
Pedro de la Rosa: We are still learning about it. It requires a lot of fine-tuning to the car - especially in the braking. KERS has to recharge itself - so when you press the brakes, it generates an extra resistance that you have to somehow compensate for to balance it out. That means interacting with the engine braking and the brake balance. You just have to find the best compromise; it’s not just fitting KERS and going quicker, you have to balance it into the whole system. If you don’t have it properly tuned, it will be very sudden. The difficulty will be to smoothen all the transitions.

Q: What additional steps need to be done to an engine to extend it from two to three races?
Ola Kallenius: It’s certainly not an inconsiderable task. We are currently analysing the engine’s areas of reliability as we plan what measures we need to take to extend its duty cycle. As you can imagine, there is a reliability buffer built into every engine but it’s not sufficient to easily extend its life from two to three races.

Q: How is Mercedes-Benz approaching the winter’s engine equalisation process?
Ola Kallenius: Like all engine manufacturers, we have until December 15 to submit our proposals to the FIA. After that date, the governing body will decide how best to approach the situation to equalise power between every team.