Front End Woes

[gagspa]

We recently replaced the front tires on the L because the driver side tire had worn irregularly. The inside corner was worn to the wire while the rest was fine. I took it in to Sears at the Parks Mall today for an alignment and this is what they told me:

Movement on both ball joints, especially the passenger
Movement on the idle arm
Both bearings need to be repacked and "tightened up"

They didn't give me a price quote on the bearings, but for everything else it was:

1 ALIGN. SERVICE $69.99
2 BALL JOINT K8695T $113.98 (56.99/EACH)
1 INSTALL BALL JOINT $30.00
1 IDLER ARM.LOCAL PURCHASE $177.15
1 INSTALL.LINKAGE $45.00

The total after tax and alignment would be $459.41. It seems high to me, but I'm not sure what to do. I asked if this was abnormal and he said not for a Ford with 80K miles because they are so "tight".

Any ideas?

Terry?

I know nothing about this stuff.

[mustgofaster]

Fordpartsonline lists the R control arm with balljoint already installed (this would also give you new pivot bushings, as it is the entire arm) for $84.26, the L side for $80.24. I know that it is more than the Sears part, but after you add the $30.00 install you are ahead on price, you have the pivot bushings & you have a FORD part.

For the idler arm, the same place lists it new from Ford for $86.42.

Wheel bearings are cheap & easy...

From my personal experience, I highly reccommend using Ford parts. I used aftermarket front end parts on my Gen 1 & had to do it all over again in just a little over 10K because the new parts were worse than the 150K parts that they replaced. Went with Ford parts the 2nd time around & no problems.

The labor charges don't sound too crazy to me.

I don't know what kind of experience you have with front-end work, but it really isn't that hard. I'm not that far from you... Could prolly help you out if you want... Even if you just want to double check to make sure they aren't blowing smoke.

Steve

[Sandman]

Did it look anything like this (http://www.talonclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17126)?

After that post I took it back to a guy I trust. They replaced the idler arm b\c it had a little slack and adjusted the toe, but everything else was good and tight. My truck only has ~40k on it. In that post you can see I waited a little too long to rotate the tires. That was 6k, I usually do it every 3k. As a matter of fact, it's right at 3k since that post. I need to check that front drivers tire and see where it is now.

Do a little searching, I know we're not the only ones that have had excessive inside drivers tire wear.

BTW, be careful with chain alignment shops. I had NTB quote me a 1k repair for my wifes truck due to all the front end "issues". Mind you the truck never wore the tires funny and still drove straight, it just had a lot of miles so I thought I would get it checked. The guy took an 8 foot pry bar, stuck it under the lower ball joint, then hung off the other end to show me "all the slack". He wanted to put camber bolts in and when I asked how far off the camber was, he said he didn't know. It seems they find all the problems without actually checking the alignment. I made him check the alignment before I signed off on any work and the camber was in spec. So I told him to adjust the toe and let me go. His 1k sale went down to $99. He got an attitude with me and said as bad as the ball joints were it would go out of alignment as soon as I drove off. BTW, I took it back a year later and the alignment hadn't moved.

[dboat]

Fordpartsonline lists the R control arm with balljoint already installed (this would also give you new pivot bushings, as it is the entire arm) for $84.26, the L side for $80.24. I know that it is more than the Sears part, but after you add the $30.00 install you are ahead on price, you have the pivot bushings & you have a FORD part.

For the idler arm, the same place lists it new from Ford for $86.42.

Wheel bearings are cheap & easy...

From my personal experience, I highly reccommend using Ford parts. I used aftermarket front end parts on my Gen 1 & had to do it all over again in just a little over 10K because the new parts were worse than the 150K parts that they replaced. Went with Ford parts the 2nd time around & no problems.

The labor charges don't sound too crazy to me.

I don't know what kind of experience you have with front-end work, but it really isn't that hard. I'm not that far from you... Could prolly help you out if you want... Even if you just want to double check to make sure they aren't blowing smoke.

Steve

I agree with using Ford parts or maybe MOOG as some of there stuff adds in some adjustability. But dont go by me, ask Terry or another trusted source for info on this.

Dana

[1stlightning]

I have the same problem with the inside of the tire wearing. I had to replace the ball joint. I went with the MOOG part for this one. I have not had a chance to get it alligned since the truck is in the shop getting some repairs and new paint. I hope that the wear problem was just the allignment.

[L8 APEX]

I have done several joints on Lightnings from 40k miles and up, so they can fail early. That is a good deal on lower joints. Uppers come complete with the a arm. I use to charge 240 lower ball joint labor because you take the spring out and whole front end apart to get to them. $30 bucks labor seems like crack money since most labor rates are 90 an hour these days. I doubt they will do it for 30 bucks... I agree the idler should be 80 or less. There are two models depending on the mounting bolt spacing. Their labor is very cheap.

[gagspa]

I just got off the phone with them and this time got a non-teenager. He said that the labor charges are set by the computer and that those prices are indeed firm regardless of how long it actually takes. The parts are Moog parts. They have the ball joints in stock but the idler arm is from a vendor and that is the vendor's price. This guy found it from a different vendor for $130. They can order all Ford parts if I want, of course I will have to pay their vendor's prices which are near list price. I can also bring in my own parts, but then there is no warranty.

I'm still not sure what to do. Steve gives me confidence that I can buy the parts cheaper and do the labor myself. Terry takes that confidence away by telling me how much work it is for him, and I know I can't even come close to Terry's speed or expertise.

I'll have to think about it. Thanks for all your opinions.

[Ohmsby]

I performed this same task on My 03 that labor price is dirt cheap IMHO

[99WhiteBeast]

I have a 120k on the clock and 10yrs later still on the original parts. The key to prevent the inside wear is a good alignment and regular tire rotation.

I would recommend a quality alignment shop for diagnosis.

See Mike at Champion Spring on Henderson in Fort Worth:tu:

[gagspa]

I decided to take the truck in on Saturday to talk with them again in person. After repeatedly telling me that they will do the labor for $30, the technician came in and said "hell no we won't!". He showed the clerk how it was supposed to be rung up and suddenly the labor went to $210. At that point I was ready to leave and do it myself but first I tried to argue parts prices. I told them that I only wanted MOOG parts and he stated that the parts quoted were MOOG. I questioned why I could find them at SEARS.com cheaper and he replied that they would price match them. (Why on earth Sears needs to pricematch Sears I don't understand.) He was able to knock the ball joints down from $56.99/each to $32.99/each and the idler arm from $177.15 to $76.99 :eek:. That meant that with the increased labor the total went up from $459.41 to $479.40. I decided to just do it since they had a tech waiting and they could do it and be done.

Steve, I really appreciate your offer to help, but I just didn't feel comfortable calling up someone I have only met and asking them to fix, or help me fix my truck. My Saturday was already ruined, I didn't want to ruin yours too. But thanks for the offer!

Anyway....About 6:30 a call comes in from the tech saying that he has installed all the parts and put it on the alignment rack but cannot finish the alignment. According to the tech, the stock parts do not allow the necessary adjustment at the upper A-arm and a set of "Cam Bolts" is needed. He said that it was something that I could easily do myself and probably buy cheaper on my own too. He said to go buy them from Orielly's or Auto Zone and put all four in. Then bring the truck back up and he'll finish the alignment under warranty. It sounded kind of odd to me as I'm only familiar with Mustangs' front ends, but my father-in-law said that another shop did the same thing with his Ford truck when he had it aligned. The tech told me that he could install them but that it would cost me a lot more money and that it was a simple job if I did it myself. So although I have paid the $500, it is still not finished!!!! :flaming: I guess that's what I'll be doing today :(

[Moonshine]

So although I have paid the $500, it is still not finished!!!! :flaming: I guess that's what I'll be doing today :(

Now that is a pisser. :nono: Hope it went well, and didn't ruin your Sunday as well as your Saturday.

[gagspa]

Now that is a pisser. :nono: Hope it went well, and didn't ruin your Sunday as well as your Saturday.
I never got off my ass long enough to go pick up the cam bolts, so I may have to do it on Wednesday after work. I'm hoping it is not too difficult to do.

[Sandman]

The key to prevent the inside wear is a good alignment and regular tire rotation.

:tu:

[PoorSvtman]

Only alignment place worth a damn in this area is Franks in ftworth..

He aligns all our bagged trucks after they leave the shop

[BradOcean]

I have access to Mitchell at my desk at work, all parts listed are OEM replacement parts from Ford......

National Account Alignment Pricing (Our discounted price from Goodyear)-64.99
Ball joints-- 78.15 each
Labor----both upper= 2.0hrs, both lower=2.8hrs
Idler Arm-- 176.38
Labor----- .6hrs

Hope it helps :cool: and if anyone ever needs part prices or labor times on anything msg me.