New Whipple 2.3

[Avalanche]

Here is the whipple 2.3

http://www.camcojb.com/2.3whipple.jpg

[StormShadow]

Thats the baby one. I think they have a BIG DADDY 3.3 for the Lightning also. Either way, they are both way more blower than whats on my truck. :d

[Avalanche]

Yea according to Ron Jim said that the 3.3 :bows (Big Daddy) will be avail sometime in Febuary.


I think I will save my pennies and get that.:nana2

[00Bolt]

better save those nickles and dimes too on this one....

[SpeedyBolt]

Those look so much better than the Eaton or the KB. I think Thats the one I will eventually go with. Being that I don't have a s/b t/b yet it would be cheaper than me buying a KB and then buying the t/b and a C&L upper. But I bet the price of the KB's come down now that those are going to be available!

[00Bolt]

if that whipple is $4k... you might as well say $9k.... im no expert... but from what i understand the KB on stock bottom end is pushing the limits..... wouldnt this almost require bottom end work?

[WA 2 FST]

if that whipple is $4k... you might as well say $9k.... im no expert... but from what i understand the KB on stock bottom end is pushing the limits..... wouldnt this almost require bottom end work?Scott,

As per the lengthy thread where we discussed this recently... I really believe its a max HP/TQ issue. But assuming it takes 18psi from an Eaton to make 450rwhp, and it only takes 13psi from a KB/Whipple to make 450rwhp, then the KB/Whipple option would be the safer route to take. (these are just theoretical boost #s, I don't know for sure...but my point is that overspinning a more inefficient blower to make the #s, will shorten the life of the blower and block compared to the better blower that is operating well within its efficiency range).

Obviously in the case of someone like you who already has extensive mods... slapping a KB or Whipple blower on there might certainly send your shortblock to the junkyard. In fact, you might have to "detune" the blower and slow it down and make even less boost than you're making now in order to keep it at a safe HP level.

But I am a firm believer that a more efficient blower to make the _same_ max HP is the way to go. The fact that the more efficient blower has the potential to make insane, block-splitting HP is just icing on the cake, so to speak.

However, what often happens is that guys get one of the high-end blowers and then set them up to make 500+rwhp, and then all bets are off... the bottom-end will go at some point, probably sooner than later.

Does anyone know when this 2.3 Whipple will be out on the market?

[WA 2 FST]

http://www.whipplesuperchargers.com/product.asp?ProdID=1170


Says available Dec. '04. I tried to e-mail them last week and didn't get a response. Maybe I should pick up the phone. :nana2

[00Bolt]

i understand your point... but with that monster, you might not be able to keep it under 450 hp... lol.....

im sure you can have that and be safe... i cant wait to see one thats for sure

[WA 2 FST]

i understand your point... but with that monster, you might not be able to keep it under 450 hp... lol.....

im sure you can have that and be safe... i cant wait to see one thats for sure
Scott, your thinking may very well end up squelching the theory behind what I was saying. In _practice_, it may indeed be impossible to keep the power down.

I would like to get to 450rwhp/550rwtq. I think this is a good way to go, and could run this blower at 12-13psi and get there. It's not cheap, but neither is adding all the other stuff (full exhaust, TB, upper intake plenum, ported blower) in an effort to get there.

[Avalanche]

WEs I was going to tell you that the 2.3 is avail right now but be ready to drop between 3500 and 4500 not sure how much it is but I do know that is way more efficent than the eaton and the KB to an extent. I know of two people (I am not saying any names) that are getting the 3.3 when it comes avail on the market.

If you want some good info on it call JDM and speak to Jim Jr.

[rickgig]

Wes:

I agree that the bottom end may need to be reworked if you are shooting for over 500hp... it just makes sense.

Check out Ford Racing Performance Part's wording "Power is expected to be increased by approximately 20 percent."

Let's see 380hp stock times .2 comes up with a modest 76hp increase totaling 456hp...

Don't know about anyone else... but 76hp gained in a more efficient manner is the way to go any day of the week!!! Only problem is most of us are running some type of mods (chip... reprogramming plus others) and I think this blower is going to place most of us in the near 500hp mark today. So... may be it is a 9k mod.

Let's see... just where did I put that piggy bank?

[BLACKSUNSHINE]

Damn thats a pretty blower, gives me a woody, anyonw want to loan me 4k?

[WA 2 FST]

Check out Ford Racing Performance Part's wording "Power is expected to be increased by approximately 20 percent."

Let's see 380hp stock times .2 comes up with a modest 76hp increase totaling 456hp...

Don't know about anyone else... but 76hp gained in a more efficient manner is the way to go any day of the week!!! Only problem is most of us are running some type of mods (chip... reprogramming plus others) and I think this blower is going to place most of us in the near 500hp mark today. Rick,

I did see that on FRPP's site. 76hp at the flywheel will be a bit less at the rear wheels. I'm at 390+rw now. I think I could safely add 60rwhp and be ok. That's still over 500hp at the flywheel, but I'm ok with trying that.

But you're right... if you've got tons of mods and then step up to the Whipple (and in some cases the KB) then you may have to slow the blower way down in order to keep the HP level sane.

I think it's a matter of not getting too greedy, to be honest. I'm not saying if my truck makes 450rwhp that it will never need a rebuild. I just think most people don't approach making power in this manner. They make XXX power and then decide they're going to get a bad boy blower and make as much power as the blower will allow. ;) Obviously, 450rwhp is very low for what a KB or Whipple _can_ produce, so that figure is laughed at by those who buy these bigger blowers.

I am of the opinion (and I know you are too) that 450rwhp from a Whipple blower will be much safer/easier on the motor than 450rwhp from a ported Eaton or another less efficient blower which might need to be spun past its intended efficiency range just to reach that power level.

Brent the difference b/w $3500 and $4500 is a lot. :D $3500 is a bargain compared to $3000 for a KB since you get a new upper intake plenum, TB, etc with the Whipple.

[Avalanche]

Brent the difference b/w $3500 and $4500 is a lot. :D $3500 is a bargain compared to $3000 for a KB since you get a new upper intake plenum, TB, etc with the Whipple.
Wes,
I agree that 1K is a big difference but if you want to play then you will have to pay right??

[Avalanche]

This is a respone to the 3.3 from Dustin at Whipple.


The 3.3 will capable of reaching the 30lb boost range. It will be very streetable, but when I say "race" means it won't come complete with a fuel system, air system, etc. because there's too many combos and most don't want parts they already have. It certainly has "instant" boost.

As for endurance test, Ford's are torturing, it's pretty funny when an aftermarket company claims they do more. I don't know of an aftermarket company that puts anything near that level. Our later Ford system go through a 50 hour endurance test, 25 at peak torque and 25 at peak hp. We put them right on the verge of detonation to test the knock system. This is very expensive and very hard on the engines.

I don't see us building a kit for the 4.6L 2V GT's. We just have so many kits going right now that it would be very difficult. You never know, but I just don't see it anytime soon. Maybe somebody would be interested in building their own kit like Steeda or somebody (Saleen already has).

Thanks,
Dustin
The 3.3L should be street legal in 05' but not at the boost levels consumers will be running. It should be available in mid to the end of december. Were trying to make it upgradeable.

As far as those who said we don't know what pulley makes what boost, that's entirely untrue. On a 100% bone stock motor, 80deg F day, 500-800ft elevation, boost will be: 3.50" (13lbs), 3.25" (15lbs), 3" (17lbs), 2.75" (19lbs). After that, you need to go the other lower pulleys to get either in between those levels or higher.

All mods make differences as well as atmospheric conditions. Whether you have a stock TB vs. the aftermarket, headers, cat back, MAF, air inlet, etc. Boost is just a measurement of the air thats not going in the valves, relieve the restriction on either side (inlet and discharge) and boost will go down, increase the restriction and the boost will go up, same blower speed.

As for drive problems, theres 3 incidents, 2 to the same customer, 1 to another, were working on something to address these concerns but I hardly call the two a major problem. Either way, it will make the product better.

We have countless hours in research on the kit, we chose to offer the system as a base package and let the dealers compliment their products and knowledge. Instead of sending parts that you may not need. This is abnormal from normal kits, but the Cobra is so heavily modified that we felt it was better to offer the system this way. Many customers already had modified vehicles and therefore we didn't want to give extra parts.

Thanks,
Dustin

[Avalanche]

Here is a pic of the rotors that are used in the Whipple.


http://www.whipplesuperchargers.com/images/howitworks/rotors.jpg

[WA 2 FST]

Wes,
I agree that 1K is a big difference but if you want to play then you will have to pay right??
Sure, I understand that. :) I just want to know is it 3500 or 4500? ;)

[Avalanche]

I found this on their site.



3300AX TWIN SCREW WHIPPLE CHARGER

Different Drive Lengths
Extension Drives in various length from
"A" 3 5/16-11 5/16
110 mm-287mm

http://www.whipplesuperchargers.com/images/productimages/compressors/3300ax_comp_sm.jpg
(Click for Larger View (http://www.whipplesuperchargers.com/images/productimages/compressors/3300ax_comp_lg.jpg))

Displacement 3.3L/REV / XXX CFM/REV.
Internal Lubrication System or
Circulating oil for some applications

Not sure if this is the 3.3. they will release for the L but it is a start.

Black 2300.00
Blue 2800.00
Polished 2800.00

[WA 2 FST]

For those shooting for well over 600rwhp, the 3.3 will be great. I understand why they wouldn't market an entire kit for a "race" type blower like that. Too many different combos to get that specific.

What I want is the 2.3 which will be a great improvement over my stock blower...and I want a complete kit I can bolt on.

[Avalanche]

I know I am posting alot of pice but here is a cutaway of the whipple.



http://www.whipplesuperchargers.com/images/howitworks/compressor_cutaway.jpg

[00Bolt]

WOW, thats beautiful inside and out!!!! if I were to slap that on my truck (3.3) id prolly be seeing near 600hp.... would be nice...

[02BOLT]

The Whipple looks like it's going to be a nice, quality kit. I agree with Wes, in that if a fella is still on his stock longblock, and wanting to make around 450 RWHP or so, then a more efficient blower making 13psig to reach "the number" is going to be safer than spinning the Eaton to 17psig to reach that same "number".

From what is being said of the 2.3, this blower should be more than sufficient for most any street driven truck. With a "built" shortblock(bottom end only) and all the supporting bolt-ons, at 18psig, the 2.3 should easily support MID-LOW 11's and possibly HIGH 10's in good air, and I'd think, be easier to tune(as compared to the 3.3). Add ported heads and cams to that equation, then it should support solid 10 second time slips all day long at the same 18 psig.(This is all ASSUMING that it does indeed perform on par with the KB.)

I wouldn't think the 3.3 would be necessary unless you're looking to run LOW 10's and maybe 9's in a fully purpose-built race-truck. If you're looking to shove 25-30 psig of boost into that motor, then you'd better be ready to be constantly replacing head gaskets, and other engine parts, because it's going to be really difficult to keep that kind of cylinder pressure in check. If there's one thing I've learned in my past endeavors, it's that there's a very fine line b/w a fast/FUN vehicle, and a fast/PAIN IN THE A$$ vehicle. The key usually lies in a well thought out COMBINATION of parts that work well TOGETHER.http://www.talonclub.com/forum/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif

[WA 2 FST]

I If you're looking to shove 25-30 psig of boost into that motor, then you'd better be ready to be constantly replacing head gaskets, and other engine parts, because it's going to be really difficult to keep that kind of cylinder pressure in check. If there's one thing I've learned in my past endeavors, it's that there's a very fine line b/w a fast/FUN vehicle, and a fast/PAIN IN THE A$$ vehicle. The key usually lies in a well thought out COMBINATION of parts that work well TOGETHER.http://www.talonclub.com/forum/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif
Amen to all this, Brother Rob. I'm right there with you. I remember pushing gaskets out on my 2-bolt 302 motor... even when the A/F ratio was _perfect_, timing was in check, etc. It was literally too much cylinder pressure for the fasteners, gaskets, and available block strength. Solution = 4-bolt block.

I don't know what the design limits are of a late model iron 5.4 block. But I would think someone who actually utilizes the vast potential of the 3.3L blower will be the one to find out! :d

Honestly, that's just another reason I may end up just sticking with what I've got. Under $1k invested in parts and I've got a bona-fide 12-second truck, which is not necessarily fast on _this_ board, but it is fast in real life, day-to-day driving. And it should run 100k miles or more like it is.

[WA 2 FST]

Here's a copy of an e-mail I just received from Whipplechargers.

_______________________________________
Wes,

I'm sorry, but we do not have a release date at this time, but we are hoping

to have it ready in the new year. I will keep your e-mail address and

notify you as soon we are ready to take orders.

Thank you for your interest,

Shonda



----- Original Message -----

From: "Wes Tarbox" <wa_2_fst@comcast.net>

To: <sales@whipplesuperchargers.com>

Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2004 1:53 PM

Subject: When will the 2.3 Whipple kit be available for the '00-04 Lightning

truck?



> Any news on when the release date will be?

>

> Thank you,

>

> -Wes Tarbox

[Avalanche]

Very interesting. Jim told Ron today that the 3.3 should be released around Feb. What of the 2.3?

[WA 2 FST]

Well, since the 3.3L blower is a non-specific kit, more than likely it will be easier to get out in production than the 2.3L, Lightning/Harley-specific kit which comes with significantly more parts. I'm hoping this is not the case, but could understand how it could be.

Whatever... I'm not in a huge hurry right now. Still collecting as much info as possible. :) I appreciate everything you're posting here, Brent.

[Avalanche]

no problem I will keep you informed as I find out information this will go good with my new motor. Of coruse after the cams go in.:D

[03LightningRocks]

Very interesting. Jim told Ron today that the 3.3 should be released around Feb. What of the 2.3?

OOPS....Maybe I wasn't suppose to repeat that info:o . I was not told to keep the info under my hat. I ask straight out...and was told straight out...By the end of Feb, in addition...I was told the would be the first folks with the 3.3 in stock.


I guess we will see. You can bet your sweet ass, I will have one sitting on top of my motor.

One more possibility...if we can come up with enough fellows in our club that want one, Terry can hook us up. He can give the details, but if he can do this, we all need to buy through him. The price will run the same no matter where you buy it.


Rocks:beer:

[WA 2 FST]

If the price is the same as everywhere else, then I'll certainly buy it through Terry. No question.

[03LightningRocks]

That's two so far ;) . We need a few more, but maybe we can get there in the next month or so.



Rocks:tu:

[00Bolt]

and if I win the lottery between no and then, I will buy mine from Terry also

[L1nt2B]

man I need to make more money :(

[rickgig]

Looks like FRPP has it available and priced at 4,095. I wonder if it includes TB, manifold and the rest of the goodies?

I copied this off the website... too bad they don't know that the Lightning was rated at 380 and not 385!!
-----------------------------------------
Jointly developed by Ford Special Vehicle Team (http://www.svt.ford.com/) (SVT) and Ford Racing Performance Parts (FRPP), this SVT Lightning project truck showcases bolt-on performance modifications that are readily available in the FRPP catalog . With an estimated 500 horsepower, this modified SVT Lightning is the perfect remedy for performance enthusiasts who feel the stock 385-horsepower Lightning is simply "adequate."




Powertrain
Ford Racing Whipple twin-screw Supercharger (Polished)

M-6066-L542RC
MSRP $4,095

Ford Racing Borla cat-back exhaust system

M-5230-L2
MSRP $565



Suspension
Ford Racing Lightning Lowering Kit

M-3000-L (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=5169)
MSRP $175

Ford Racing Lightning Chrome wheels

M-1007-Q189C (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=6535)
MSRP $350/each

[WA 2 FST]

That is a new update since the last time I checked the website. Cool.

I would think that price certainly comes with everything included to make it run.

Now, what would be cool is if Ford would allow you to retain your warranty if, say, an authorized Ford dealer installed it. Probably too much to ask, but I know special stuff like this has been done in the past.

I see a part # listed, but since there's no link to the part, I'm not sure if its _really_ out yet. I'm sure the FRPP guys got a prototype and bolted it on and did some preliminary testing.

[Tex Arcana]

Amen to all this, Brother Rob. I'm right there with you. I remember pushing gaskets out on my 2-bolt 302 motor... even when the A/F ratio was _perfect_, timing was in check, etc. It was literally too much cylinder pressure for the fasteners, gaskets, and available block strength. Solution = 4-bolt block.

I don't know what the design limits are of a late model iron 5.4 block. But I would think someone who actually utilizes the vast potential of the 3.3L blower will be the one to find out! :d

Honestly, that's just another reason I may end up just sticking with what I've got. Under $1k invested in parts and I've got a bona-fide 12-second truck, which is not necessarily fast on _this_ board, but it is fast in real life, day-to-day driving. And it should run 100k miles or more like it is.

Well, if those motors are anything like Ken's was, then you've got alot of potential to play with. :d

And you konw as well as I do that you just CAN'T leave well enough alone, and that you're gonna wanna DO it, if only to know you can smoke even more people at any given time!! :tu:

[Tex Arcana]

no problem I will keep you informed as I find out information this will go good with my new motor. Of coruse after the cams go in.:D

And where are the pics of the buildup??? Hmm??? :d

[Avalanche]

No buildup it is already built but the heads need to be proted and polished and then cams added.

[Tex Arcana]

No buildup it is already built but the heads need to be proted and polished and then cams added.

Thread and pics, stat!! :tongue: